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S.E. 5a is not an Acemaker


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#41 Panthercules

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 16:35

150 Meter convergence mens at 300 meters bullets are further apart than gun barrels are. My accuracy in S.E.5 jumped when I set it to 500m (just shoot straight). May just be me.

 

I remember some thread(s) from a few years ago regarding convergence settings, but unfortunately I don't remember the eventual conclusion.  However, the gist of it was that, whereas we generally think of convergence in WWII terms as a horizontal concept as the distance in front of the plane at which the bullets from guns on one wing cross/meet with the bullets from the guns on the other wing, for WWI aircraft convergence is actually a vertical concept - i.e., the distance at which the bullets from the gun(s) drop back across the sight line (having been fired slightly upward initially). 

 

I'm not sure what's right, but the latter (vertical) concept makes a lot more sense to me.  The horizontal (WWII) concept never made sense to me when talking about 2 nose-mounted guns that are only about a foot apart, and it can't even possibly apply to those early planes that only have one gun.  Given that in RoF you can set convergence on these early planes that only have 1 gun, it seems to me that the devs must be using this as a vertical concept, not a horizontal one.  (Even though they use an icon/symbol for it in the hangar menu screen that depicts it horizontally, that's probably just so it would be understandable/recognizable by most people.)


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#42 Wykletypl

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 13:31

I just came back to S.E 5a in a Quick Mission. So for the statement I made previously... Well, I was able to shoot down 3 planes, while 'poorly' trying out BnZ (I don't know, I think I do kills with these scouts better by ambushing and attempting to kill with first attempt). And well, it can be flown. 

 

But still... Why is this plane so tail-heavy? It should be front heavy, given it's construction and profile.

 

And another issue that I talked about already... It really would be much easier if enemy AI planes stopped chasing You after 500 metres, not 1500 as it is now. 


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#43 US103_Furlow

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 14:09

I just came back to S.E 5a in a Quick Mission. So for the statement I made previously... Well, I was able to shoot down 3 planes, while 'poorly' trying out BnZ (I don't know, I think I do kills with these scouts better by ambushing and attempting to kill with first attempt). And well, it can be flown. 

 

But still... Why is this plane so tail-heavy? It should be front heavy, given it's construction and profile.

 

And another issue that I talked about already... It really would be much easier if enemy AI planes stopped chasing You after 500 metres, not 1500 as it is now. 

Its not tail heavy its just that the wings produce extra lift at high speeds which causes the plane to want to climb.  Using the stabilizer trim helps a lot.  


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#44 hq_Reflected

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 16:27

It's not tail heavy. Neutral position of the elevator is achieved with a slight forward stick. It's the spring of your joystick that doesn't know this. It's been explained ad nauseam, run a few searches.


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#45 US103_Furlow

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 16:48

I think I'm getting the hang of the SE5a as I haven't ripped my own wings off in a while and my shooting has gotten a little better.  Still have convergence set to 150 meters.


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#46 JoeCrow

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 21:15

Its not tail heavy its just that the wings produce extra lift at high speeds which causes the plane to want to climb.  Using the stabilizer trim helps a lot.  

This is quite correct. An aircraft will always want to climb if airspeed exceeds that for which it is trimmed (cruise-speed). Adding more thrust increases lift (and drag) in proportion to airspeed at the ratio of 2:1, until you finally run out of excess thrust-over-weight. The more thrust you add above cruise-speed the more the plane wants to climb instead of increasing level-flight speed. The Se5a trim-wheel allows you to trim for various airspeeds (within limits) by changing the angle of inclination of the horizontal stabilizer and not the elevator. If you don't have a trim-wheel you will need to use the elevator and brute force to overcome the force of lift at speeds higher than cruise-speed. The big problem with this method is that by using the elevator instead of  the trim-wheel (the horizontal stabilizer) it becomes very inaccurate and increases drag. As a result, the Se5a will reach  ~130mph in level flight with 50% fuel if you use the trim-wheel correctly. It is more likely to be ~120mph if you rely only on the stick (elevator) and brute force.

Cheers.


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#47 J2_Wulfe

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 21:23

I don't really have much experience to speak from, but I'd like to share some of my experiences relating to the SE5a just to add to the conversation  :P 

I've had the most success in the S.E.5a out of all the entente birds by a long shot..out of the 12 Central kills I've managed to accumulate this month on WG, 10 have been in the S.E.5a. Once I figured out the proper way to fly it, I started feeling confident in it. And, for the most part, my deaths in the S.E.5 have been due to flying it wrong or misreading a situation. 

When it comes to fighting the S.E.5a (usually in an Alby Dv), S.E.5s have been both my easiest kills and my hardest opponents. The really good S.E.5 pilots have given me a nightmare of a time on WG so far, and the less experienced ones that try to turn have only succeeded in helping me add to my score  ;) 

Is it an acemaker? In my opinion, absolutely! 



 


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#48 JoeCrow

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 21:49

I don't really have much experience to speak from, but I'd like to share some of my experiences relating to the SE5a just to add to the conversation  :P 

I've had the most success in the S.E.5a out of all the entente birds by a long shot..out of the 12 Central kills I've managed to accumulate this month on WG, 10 have been in the S.E.5a. Once I figured out the proper way to fly it, I started feeling confident in it. And, for the most part, my deaths in the S.E.5 have been due to flying it wrong or misreading a situation. 

When it comes to fighting the S.E.5a (usually in an Alby Dv), S.E.5s have been both my easiest kills and my hardest opponents. The really good S.E.5 pilots have given me a nightmare of a time on WG so far, and the less experienced ones that try to turn have only succeeded in helping me add to my score  ;) 

Is it an acemaker? In my opinion, absolutely! 



 

Nicely summed up.

Cheers.


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#49 paullmf2

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Posted 01 January 2018 - 01:39

Not an FM complaint. Taking the planes purely as is in game. Looking for advice only :)

In an SE5a, D7f's still give me the willies unless I have good alt advantage, surprise and no damage. Against a good pilot you're unlikely to get surprise.
Pre-engagement manoeuvres are then tricky, the longer you wait or try to climb, the better his relative position becomes and the higher you go the better the d7f performs.

Get slightly damaged and there's little speed adv left.

I really like flying the SE5a and feel confident to at least survive most encounters, except as above

Edit: Actually I do know the answer. Gang up on the buggers!
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"Gathering his pilots around him on arrival he gave a pep talk, saying that they were equipped with the finest machine of all time and had three battle-experienced flight commanders. He expected every one of them to fight like hell and that it must never be said that any of them ever failed to go to the aid of a comrade, regardless of the cost, and that no patrol was ever to be late in taking off."

 

Major Keith 'Grid' Caldwell, 74 Sq


#50 paullmf2

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Posted 01 January 2018 - 03:07

I should've re-read the thread. Plenty of advice for handling D7fs.

And of course, this..

One victory on SeVa, there is a minimum of three on FD7F, and maybe more. If the flight is not on FiF, I sometimes prefer not to run away on this plane, but still dance in bends, it's very interesting, although they are often knocked down. If you compare SeVa and FD7F, then this will be: SeVa, as a live girl with emotions, and FD7F - an inflatable doll from a sex store, but she never argues with you ;-)


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"Gathering his pilots around him on arrival he gave a pep talk, saying that they were equipped with the finest machine of all time and had three battle-experienced flight commanders. He expected every one of them to fight like hell and that it must never be said that any of them ever failed to go to the aid of a comrade, regardless of the cost, and that no patrol was ever to be late in taking off."

 

Major Keith 'Grid' Caldwell, 74 Sq


#51 US103_Furlow

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Posted 01 January 2018 - 04:10

Best way to fight D7F's while alone is to not fight them.  Shoot and scoot.  Always allow yourself enough altitude to dive all the way back to friendly territory.


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