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Trim Controls - Please!!!!


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#1 James_Brady

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Posted 21 November 2014 - 18:38

I am new to this simulator and it is fantastic, except for one thing. The lack of trim controls! I have tried every key for the stabilizer trim and nothing works. I have to continuously keep the joystick pushed forward and that is frustrating and ridiculous. I don't care if the real airplane had stabilizer trim or not.. We're not in the real airplane. We're playing at a desk with a plastic joystick. Not having this control makes the game unenjoyably and I don't think I'll be playing anymore or purchasing any new aircraft.

Where was the logic in leaving out the simple control..?

-James B
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#2 1PL-Husar

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Posted 21 November 2014 - 18:47

Most of those planes didn't have any kind of pitch trim. Instead you can compensate nose up attitude with full throttle by curves.



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#3 James_Brady

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Posted 23 November 2014 - 15:24

Ok thanks. I will give that a try.
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#4 Pirato

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Posted 23 November 2014 - 15:37

Only few allied planes make use of the Stabilizer ,out of my head it's the SE5a,Sopwith Triplane,RE8,Bristol Fighter and Airco DH4. There are atleast 2 others I dont remember right now.

For the other planes you have to either keep pushing the stick forward or you can set the Center point down in the responses menu.
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#5 B24_LIBERATOR

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 07:01

Dh2 appears to have one modeled in the cockpit but it's non-functioning.
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Liberator's Tutorials: http://steamcommunit...s/?id=438268482

 

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#6 Zlatarov

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 14:17

Dh2 appears to have one modeled in the cockpit but it's non-functioning.

+1

Not shore if the real plan has it at all, but in the game there is a wheel for it, at least!
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#7 SYN_Bandy

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 17:06

…I don't care if the real airplane had stabilizer trim or not.. We're not in the real airplane. We're playing at a desk with a plastic joystick. Not having this control makes the game unenjoyably and I don't think I'll be playing anymore or purchasing any new aircraft.

Where was the logic in leaving out the simple control..?
Well James, most of us playing RoF all these years do care about the fidelity of the simulation. If the developers had given trim to aircraft that didn't historically have trim, then there would have been an uproar beyond measure in the player community.

As you have found out there are ways around this (curves), also getting a force feedback joystick.

Hope this meets your needs for enjoyment.
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#8 mikedelta

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 14:42

I have flown aeroplanes from that era and I can assure you they certainly did have trim controls either by moving the tailplane assembly or by springs connected to the control column. It is absurd to think aviators of the time would have flown for long periods holding pressure on the stick to remain level.

 

I, too, have just started playing this game and the developers need to fix this asap to prevent themselves suffering professional ridicule.


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#9 xvii-Dietrich

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 15:06

I have flown aeroplanes from that era and I can assure you they certainly did have trim controls either by moving the tailplane assembly or by springs connected to the control column. It is absurd to think aviators of the time would have flown for long periods holding pressure on the stick to remain level.

 

I, too, have just started playing this game and the developers need to fix this asap to prevent themselves suffering professional ridicule.

 

WWI aircraft (generally) did not have "in-cockpit trim wheels" for each control surface. If you can find an exception to this, which is thus incorrectly modelled in RoF, please let us know by stating the aircraft model and an authoritative reference.

 

However, you are absolutely right that WWI aircraft could be adjusted on the ground to "tune" the flight surfaces to make them easier to handle in the air.

 

But this is already available in RoF!

 

Go to the options section in the game, and then Response. By adjusting the response curves in the control section. With curve tuning, you readily get the same effect (if not better!). I have adjusted my nose-trim this way to have a more balanced flight, which lets me take my hands off the controls for a considerable period of time without needing to correct or adjust.

 

 

I don't think the developers deserve any ridicule on this topic.


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#10 =HillBilly=

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 18:15

The only one in ROF that I can think of had trim control in real life that doesn't in ROF is the Airco D.H. 2. 

Attached File  trim.jpg   274.63KB   9 downloads


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#11 Arty_Effem

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 20:22

the developers need to fix this asap to prevent themselves suffering professional ridicule.

 

I can assure you that has never concerned them in the slightest.


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#12 Demon_

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 20:31

:icon_e_wink:

Attached Files


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#13 Arty_Effem

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 23:31

The only one in ROF that I can think of had trim control in real life that doesn't in ROF is the Airco D.H. 2. 

attachicon.giftrim.jpg

I think I read somewhere that 'they' have said they're not going to animate or implement that control. Going by the look of it, it appears to be an incremental control that would require some unique code written for it.


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#14 =HillBilly=

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Posted 05 May 2016 - 11:25

The only one in ROF that I can think of had trim control in real life that doesn't in ROF is the Airco D.H. 2. 

attachicon.giftrim.jpg

 

I think I read somewhere that 'they' have said they're not going to animate or implement that control. Going by the look of it, it appears to be an incremental control that would require some unique code written for it.

No more unique than the code for this. :icon_e_salute:

Attached File  this.jpg   156.77KB   7 downloads


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#15 LukeFF

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Posted 06 May 2016 - 20:32

I think I read somewhere that 'they' have said they're not going to animate or implement that control. Going by the look of it, it appears to be an incremental control that would require some unique code written for it.

 

Correct, it's a spring-loaded mechanism that would require coding different than what is present right now.


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#16 =HillBilly=

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 13:20

Correct, it's a spring-loaded mechanism that would require coding different than what is present right now.

Could you explain the difference between the incremental control of the DH 2 trim and the incremental control of the N 28 selector switch. 


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#17 unreasonable

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 13:28

Could you explain the difference between the incremental control of the DH 2 trim and the incremental control of the N 28 selector switch. 

 

I can try. ;)

 

1) The selector switch for the N28 took far more coding than an incremental elevator trim for the DH2; not only changing rpm but also the sound file use and fuel consumption. 

2) The N28 was used by the Americans, so deserved more TLC than the boring old RFC DH2 which no-one wants to fly because it is the "wrong" version anyway. 


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#18 =HillBilly=

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 13:29

I can try. ;)

 

1) The selector switch for the N28 took far more coding than an incremental elevator trim for the DH2; not only changing rpm but also the sound file use and fuel consumption. 

2) The N28 was used by the Americans, so deserved more TLC than the boring old RFC DH2 which no-one wants to fly because it is the "wrong" version anyway. 

LOL

 

 

 

P.S.  the N 28 selector switch will make little difference in fuel consumption,except the difference in RPM.

       The damn thing draws in the same amount of fuel on 1/2 power as full power. Just the nature of the beast. ;)


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#19 C.M.Bailey

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 15:44

It sounds like your joystick may be a little out of whack. That said, some of these planes naturally climb with neutral elevator. You can however, cause any plane to be nose heavier by simply adjusting the response curve down.


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#20 Hapo

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Posted 22 February 2017 - 00:11

...everyone wants to blame your controller it seems...

 

...this thread just prevented me from returning mine...


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#21 JoeCrow

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Posted 22 February 2017 - 23:17

Flight is a complicated business. If you are talking about in-flight trim then you have to remember that the attitude of an aircraft in level-flight is determined by its speed through the air (airspeed) and not by the joystick position. This is easily tested by reducing your level-flight speed and seeing the nose drop. That is why later aircraft design included an in-flight trimwheel (because the problem could not be resolved with the joystick alone). Aircraft are designed for level flight at cruise-speed which is something like 70% of maximum level-flight speed, and the reason is to avoid engine failure (100% pedal-to-the-metal, which destroys engines). If you trim an aircraft to fly level at maximum throttle you also introduce all sorts of problems at low-speed and landing safely or level bombing becomes a really dangerous gamble. Like I said, in-flight trim solves this problem but we are dealing with early flight in WW1 and a simulator is exactly what it says on the tin. Some joysticks actiually include an in-flight trimwheel. That said, I do have sympathy with those that are fighting the joystick but that is exactly as it really was.
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#22 Odovacer

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Posted 02 May 2017 - 12:32

Thank you, thank you for this thread. I was about to start a similar one on my own. I know that early planes had the tendencies as described, but I was unprepared for the degree to which it occurred having spent most of my time on WWII and jet sims and no doubt some was coded out.

 

My problem was the degree and I've been wracked with uncertainty about my joystick, my flying or the aircraft. If I turned to "check 6" and reverted back to forward view I'd inevitably be climbing and probably be banking. Long flights, particularly in formation are tiring. My flight stick is not the best, (Logitech Attack 3). I picked it up used since I didn't have one. But it seems to check out for various calibrations.

 

I get the simulation aspect. I've been doing various sims for years and I lean towards the purist side. But wow, it's a struggle. There's a lot to this game/sim and I've nearly thrown it down it frustration (somehow I destroyed the engine of my Albatross Va in mid-flight yesterday and it wasn't collision. First flight for that plane).

 

Some questions. Are the flight curve adjustments permitted in Multiplayer?

 

PS Thanks 1PL-Husar for that video link.


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#23 FourSpeed

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Posted 02 May 2017 - 17:12

To answer your question, Yes, your curve adjustments are yours - they will still work in multiplayer.

 

For long flights, where you're also wanting to look around, you can also engage "Altitude Hold" (Shift - A key) and your plane will continue flying straight and level.  That also works in MP and it's a handy option to use for several things (like bombing and recon), but of course, it's not particularly "realistic", so some pilots may find it immersion breaking...  YMMV

 

 

Regards,

4 :icon_e_salute:


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#24 ElvisDaKing

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 11:37

Hi Everyone

 

I have installed recently ROF and to be honest i am really struggling when flying Nieuport N.11 and N.17...

I have tried to adjust the response curves according my understandings - and again thanks to those who posted videos and advices, but i have not been very succesful until now...

(I am flying Full Realism)

 

I would appreciate if some of you can post a few screenshots of your response curves set up for the Nieuport so I can base my own accordingly and then play a little bit with it, so I can better understand how it works

 

Thanks in advance for your help


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#25 J2_Bidu

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 22:05

I don't use curves, it's just a personal choice. It may have aggravated my N11 acting like a wild horse, a few years ago.

 

But at the time I had a Speedlink Black Widow joystick, and it sucked sooo much. I suppose it was even spiking a bit. I remember attempting to overcome that with curves, to no avail. With a better joystick, I didn't feel I needed curves anymore. I'm sure people put them to good use, I just don't mind suffering the lack of them.

 

What I mean is, do consider other possible factors which may be contributing to your difficulties. But sure, adjusting the curves is certainly a cheaper first option to explore than looking around for a new joystick. Good luck!


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#26 B24_LIBERATOR

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 23:44

Check out the link in my signature, got a chapter on response curves and trimming :icon_e_salute:

 

Also, 4 years later and they still haven't modeled the DH.2's trim.


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Liberator's Tutorials: http://steamcommunit...s/?id=438268482

 

tahhfk.jpg


#27 US103_Baer

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Posted 12 June 2018 - 00:21

JG1_Luftritter has a couple of excellent videos on YouTube re setting up response curves for N11 and N17 and then flying them for best performance.

youtu.be/18MHD9XViKc
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#28 ElvisDaKing

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Posted 12 June 2018 - 16:16

Thanks Guys

 

Very useful information... Exactly what i was looking for  :icon_e_salute: 


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