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Squad skins (PWCG)


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#1 GTOAviator

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 07:03

Recently tried out the Pat Wilson mod for RoF. It is most excellent! However, I'm was wondering if there is any way to get each squad flying around to don their appropriate skins? I've noticed that the aces automatically use their custom skin, but I haven't noticed this consistency with regular squad members.

Also I apologize if this question has been asked a million times before, I tried looking through the big PWCG thread and couldn't find anything.
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#2 Pirato

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 08:19

What Version are you using? In the newest Version Skins are randomly assigned depending on Service and Squadron. Newest Version is here Version 13.2.1 Released
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#3 GTOAviator

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 00:03

I just downloaded it a couple weeks ago. Probably the newest version.

Just so I understand, when you begin a new campaign each squad is randomly given skins, but not necessarily historically correct, or..?
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#4 Barkhorn1x

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 00:56

I just downloaded it a couple weeks ago. Probably the newest version.

Just so I understand, when you begin a new campaign each squad is randomly given skins, but not necessarily historically correct, or..?

A couple of weeks ago? No, not the newest version then. Pat works fast.

Here:
http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html

About those skins:
- Each squad generally has their default historical skin - if one currently exists
- And a mix of plausible skins - but not ace skins as those are reserved
- In Advance Parems you can tell the program to omit the fictional plausible ones and the historical ones as well and the default historical skin will be used - if one currently exists
- Pat is in the midst of a huge project to fill in all the gaps on the default historical skins
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#5 HotTom

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 01:05

I turned off the random skins in the preferences after flying RFC missions with a jumble of different squadron markings as my wingmen. They all appear to have the correct squadron markings with random skins de-selected. (That's with current version 13.2.1)
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#6 PatAWilson

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 02:23

If there are any squadrons that are not using a correct and available skin please let me know which squadron, which skin, and what date. It is all configured in a data file.

Latest PWCG is available from my web site/
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#7 GTOAviator

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 02:23

Whoop whoop!! :S!: :S!: Excellent - I must try this out immediately. Any tricks to updating or will the new version take natural precedence?
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#8 HotTom

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 02:56

If there are any squadrons that are not using a correct and available skin please let me know which squadron, which skin, and what date. It is all configured in a data file.

Latest PWCG is available from my web site/

Pat,

If I have "randon skins" enabled and I am flying, say, 56 Squadron, will (or should) all my wingmen have 56 squadron markings? Or will they have a random combination of markings (because that's what I saw)?

That's why I disabled "random skins." Maybe I didn't need to?

Thanks,

:S!:

HT
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#9 Barkhorn1x

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:46

Whoop whoop!! :S!: :S!: Excellent - I must try this out immediately. Any tricks to updating or will the new version take natural precedence?

GTO;

Always delete the old version - then unzip the new one - configure - set up a campaign - and fly.
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#10 PatAWilson

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 13:29

HT: Squadrons will use truly random skins. For British squadrons, such usage should be rare. What happens is to some degree dependent on how many skins are available for a squadron, for the plane, etc. For British squadrons the odds of a fictional skin being used are only 10%. So if you are flying 56 squadron with fictional skins enabled then about one time in 10 an odd skin will be assigned. The rest should be squadron appropriate or just the squadron default skin.
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#11 HotTom

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 15:59

HT: Squadrons will use truly random skins. For British squadrons, such usage should be rare. What happens is to some degree dependent on how many skins are available for a squadron, for the plane, etc. For British squadrons the odds of a fictional skin being used are only 10%. So if you are flying 56 squadron with fictional skins enabled then about one time in 10 an odd skin will be assigned. The rest should be squadron appropriate or just the squadron default skin.

Okay. Well, I'll play with that random button some more.

I thought I posted it when it happened but now I can't find the post. It was just earlier this week. I was flying a 74 squadron mission in May 1918 and my SE5as had markings from 74 squadron, 40 squadron, and several others all lined up together on the field. "Random Skins" was selected.

Is that a result of "random" skins or a bug? With "random skins" selected, should they still all have been 74 squadron skins or a mix?

Not criticising, btw, just trying to understand how it works.

Man that pink lettering is bright! :mrgreen:

:S!:

HT
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#12 PatAWilson

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 16:36

HT: leave it disabled for now and try again in 13.3. I made some changes to tighten up skin selection in the upcoming version.
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#13 HotTom

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 17:01

Cool! Thank you!
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#14 Palatine

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 06:43

Just started using PWCG and it is spectacular — great work and much appreciated.

Just a little note — I noticed some odd skins behavior (13.8, random skins off) flying in the Esc 124 Lafayette. When the squadron is flying Nieuport 11.C1 in early 1916 all planes show correct default skins. Later, though, the squadron switches to Nieuport 17.C1 and PWCG uses the new British N17 with the Lewis gun. My PWCG picks up only the default RFC skin for this plane every time. I think the data file needs to point to the "regular" N17C folder as well where it will find late summer 1916 French skins for this squadron.

Thanks again Pat for all your hard work
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#15 Razneff

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 11:40

Palatine, I think the fact is that the n17C1 skin's aren't compatible with the n17gbr model, and that no frensh skin for the n17gbr haven't yet been "officialy" implemented into RoF. I also think that, historically, even the frensh used lewis mounted N17's before the vicker's one.
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#16 PatAWilson

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 16:30

French skins for the N17 Lewis are not yet available. Some do exist and if I can get permission I will make them available. If not then I might make at least one default French skin myself so you at least have a silver N17 with French markings.
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#17 Panthercules

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 17:15

French skins for the N17 Lewis are not yet available. Some do exist and if I can get permission I will make them available. If not then I might make at least one default French skin myself so you at least have a silver N17 with French markings.


Several of these French-skinned N17/GBR Lewis-armed versions have already been done (I have been working on creating all the necessary/appropriate ones, along with J.j. who has provided some very useful information/references), and Luke and I are working on integrating them into the career mode. The skins won't be available for mods-off use until the next patch release, but I'll be happy to make them available to Pat for temporary use with PWCG in the meantime.

I'll have to deal with that later tonight when I get back from work though, so stand by…
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#18 Palatine

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 18:09

Thanks Pat and Panthercules — I was/am confused by the fact that I can set my *own* N17/GBR to show a French skin (using the Hanger before each mission) and I presume that these non-default skins are for the regular N17 and somehow I can access them for the GBR also — so I thought that the other planes in the flight might be able to use them as well, at least for now. But of course (a) I don't really know how this stuff works, and (b) this isn't really the correct solution for the long term, anyway, which is what you are working on. Bless you!
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#19 Panthercules

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 18:19

Thanks Pat and Panthercules — I was/am confused by the fact that I can set my *own* N17/GBR to show a French skin (using the Hanger before each mission) and I presume that these non-default skins are for the regular N17 and somehow I can access them for the GBR also — so I thought that the other planes in the flight might be able to use them as well, at least for now. But of course (a) I don't really know how this stuff works, and (b) this isn't really the correct solution for the long term, anyway, which is what you are working on. Bless you!

Hmm - I haven't looked at those hangar screens for a while, so I'll have to do that when I get back to my RoF PC later tonight and see what's going on with that.
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#20 PatAWilson

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 18:50

PWCG has to be rigged to make a squadron use the right skins. I have not yet done that rigging for French Lewis mounted N17s, so any plane will fall through to the default. Not sure how you are seeing any French N17 skins for the Lewis N17, unless you copied some Vickers N17 skins over … maybe? don't know :)
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#21 Palatine

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Posted 04 June 2013 - 00:32

No, actually I think the confusion is my fault for not noticing a key point – I think the squadron is flying a mixture of N11's and N17/GBR's and I didn't notice that as the "new guy" I'm (usually?) flying the older model. No wonder I can't keep up in formation with them : ) Is that possible? Whenever any N17GBRs are in the flight they have the default skin, but I can reskin my N11 as usual. I thought I was flying an N17 and could see alternate skins for it, but, of course, I wasn't and couldn't if I was. Mystery solved? Sorry for the confusion!
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#22 Panthercules

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Posted 04 June 2013 - 06:38

@ Palatine - Aha - glad you figured it out, 'cause you had me stumped with that one.

@ Pat - check your PM - I have sent you the link to 25 new N17/GBR skins, including a bunch of French ones that have been created/converted to represent the Escadrilles known to have flown the Lewis-only version. These should be available for use in mods off mode and beta career in the next update/release, but feel free to make them available in the meantime for use with PWCG in mods-on mode.
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#23 Palatine

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 22:40

Wow, thanks guys for the new N17/GBR skins in 13.9 — all looks great (and all French) in the campaign I'm flying (ESC 124, August, 1916).
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#24 Sigrun

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 17:04

Is it correct to assume all the skins being talked about here are the ones from the historical skin-packs available in 'Useful Materials'?
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#25 HotTom

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 17:33

No. PWCG uses those and others that have been optimized by date, squadron, etc.

Get them here (in fact get everything PWCG here):

http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html

Load them in the normal RoF Data/Graphics/Skins folders
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#26 Sigrun

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 18:53

Cheers Tom. :)
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#27 nbryant

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 23:38

Pat, I started a campaign with the 124th with assigned 17's. I started off assigned an 11 and changed the setup to a 17 but the only option was the GBr 17. Is this correct?
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#28 HotTom

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 23:44

It's correct. It's a stand-in for the early French N17s before they had synchronized Vickers guns (last half of 1916). At some point it will switch to the French N17.
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#29 Panthercules

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 17:44

No. PWCG uses those and others that have been optimized by date, squadron, etc.

Get them here (in fact get everything PWCG here):

http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html

Load them in the normal RoF Data/Graphics/Skins folders


I am in the process of coordinating with Pat so that (at least most of) the non-approved skins currently being used by PWCG will be contained in the approved Historical Skin Pack when the next Volume is released. So, eventually, they will also be available for use in both PWCG and the beta career mode, and both for mods off as well as mods on use. In the meantime, they can be enjoyed in "mods on" mode with PWCG as noted above.
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#30 Dutch2

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 07:18

No. PWCG uses those and others that have been optimized by date, squadron, etc.

Get them here (in fact get everything PWCG here):

http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html

Load them in the normal RoF Data/Graphics/Skins folders


I am in the process of coordinating with Pat so that (at least most of) the non-approved skins currently being used by PWCG will be contained in the approved Historical Skin Pack when the next Volume is released. So, eventually, they will also be available for use in both PWCG and the beta career mode, and both for mods off as well as mods on use. In the meantime, they can be enjoyed in "mods on" mode with PWCG as noted above.

Any progress in this process, would like to know, I do prefer downloading from the official historic skin pack.
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#31 Panthercules

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 12:56

No. PWCG uses those and others that have been optimized by date, squadron, etc.

Get them here (in fact get everything PWCG here):

http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.pwcampaig...bSite/PWCG.html

Load them in the normal RoF Data/Graphics/Skins folders


I am in the process of coordinating with Pat so that (at least most of) the non-approved skins currently being used by PWCG will be contained in the approved Historical Skin Pack when the next Volume is released. So, eventually, they will also be available for use in both PWCG and the beta career mode, and both for mods off as well as mods on use. In the meantime, they can be enjoyed in "mods on" mode with PWCG as noted above.

Any progress in this process, would like to know, I do prefer downloading from the official historic skin pack.


I have created over 120 new squadron default skins myself, and processed and submitted almost 200 new ones from Pat and his team, so the next Historical Skin Pack release should be chock full of new approved skins for use in both PWCG and beta Career mode with "mods off". I do not know, however, what 777's testing and release schedule plans are for the next update, so I'm not sure when we're going to see the next skin pack volume become available.
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#32 Dutch2

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 14:14

that is great and thanks for the fast reply,
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#33 PatAWilson

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 15:33

Question: I noticed that the skins are no longer loose in the skins directory. How can I find the names of the skins?

My code currently checks for a skin in the skins directory before using it in a mission. If all of these files are embedded in an archive then that method no longer works. Not an issue if I can get a list of "known" skins that I can use without checking the directory, but I need that list.

Thanks.
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#34 Panthercules

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 18:47

Question: I noticed that the skins are no longer loose in the skins directory. How can I find the names of the skins?

My code currently checks for a skin in the skins directory before using it in a mission. If all of these files are embedded in an archive then that method no longer works. Not an issue if I can get a list of "known" skins that I can use without checking the directory, but I need that list.

Thanks.


Pat - is that a question for me? If so, I don't know what you mean by "no longer loose in the skins directory", so I'm not sure how to respond.

As noted in some other post (I'll have to search for it if needed) there are a few skins which seem to be "missing/hidden" and located somewhere other than the normal skin folders. IIRC, in that discussion we never figured out exactly where they are located, but I don't think that there are very many of them like that. As far as I know, there hasn't been any change such that skins that used to be in the normal folders (which would be almost all of them) are now hiding somewhere else or embedded in some archive, so I'm not sure what problem you're seeing or talking about here.
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#35 PatAWilson

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 19:10

It was the same subject. Maybe I am making more of it than there is, but it seemed that 777 had put some of the the skins … somewhere. It seems to me that there are more than a few. I assumed an archive since that is the way that most games do it, but I could be wrong.

Anyhow, my goal is to know which skins are guaranteed to appear in the game. Verifying a file in the "skins" folder is the only way that I know right now. For some skins that seems not to be the case, and I am just trying to understand.
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#36 elephant

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 19:26

The default skin per plane is located in a different than the skins folder,
along with the normal map…
ie: Rise of Flight\data\graphics\planes\*planename*\textures
(*planename*=albatrosd3 for example)

I don't know what Pat means, either… :?
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#37 Panthercules

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 20:40

The default skin per plane is located in a different than the skins folder,
along with the normal map…
ie: Rise of Flight\data\graphics\planes\*planename*\textures
(*planename*=albatrosd3 for example)

I don't know what Pat means, either… :?

@ elephant - I know that you can alter the standard default skins by putting a replacement skin in the location you mention, but I'm not sure that the standard default skins themselves are already in those locations - I think it may be a case of the game checking those locations and using the replacement skin file if it finds one there, but otherwise using the standard default skin from some embedded archive if it doesn't find a replacement skin there (I'm away from my RoF PC so cannot confirm that theory).

@ Pat - Maybe I'm missing something here, but from what I've been told by the devs the only impact of telling the game in a mission file to use a skin file that isn't in the user's game installation is that the game will automatically fall back to using the standard default skin. Thus, if the default skins are the ones that are "missing/hidden" then their missing status doesn't seem like it should matter very much. if at all.
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#38 PatAWilson

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 21:30

Panther - you are right, if the requested skin does not exist then it goes to the default. My problem is that I do not want that. I have hierarchies that I want to cascade through, checking for the existence of the preferred skin and dropping to the next and then the next. Default is my last resort. That's why I want some means of determining which, if any, skins are archived.
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#39 pomjon

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Posted 20 July 2013 - 00:28

Whats the drill for installing these mods using JSGME? I noticed the file structure is different in some of the zips, does this matter? I dumped the whole folders into the MODS folder and tried to enable with JSGME but keep getting those error messages, like:

Folder "PWCGSkins" has already been added by the "AD3_Mar1917" mod.
Folder "PWCGSkins\data" has already been added by the "AD3_Mar1917" mod.
Folder "PWCGSkins\data\Skins" has already been added by the "AD3_Mar1917" mod.
Folder "PWCGSkins\data\Skins\PfalzD3a" has already been added by the "PfalzD3a_Apr1918" mod.
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#40 Panthercules

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Posted 20 July 2013 - 02:03

Whats the drill for installing these mods using JSGME? I noticed the file structure is different in some of the zips, does this matter? I dumped the whole folders into the MODS folder and tried to enable with JSGME but keep getting those error messages, like:

Folder "PWCGSkins" has already been added by the "AD3_Mar1917" mod.
Folder "PWCGSkins\data" has already been added by the "AD3_Mar1917" mod.
Folder "PWCGSkins\data\Skins" has already been added by the "AD3_Mar1917" mod.
Folder "PWCGSkins\data\Skins\PfalzD3a" has already been added by the "PfalzD3a_Apr1918" mod.

I'm not sure about the folder structure of the things you're talking about - you'd have to check with Pat on that one.

But, those aren't really "error" messages. They're just alerting you to the fact that certain files and/or folders were already created or replaced by previous mods you have activated.

If the things mentioned in the messages are files, then there is some conflict/overlap between the mod you are trying to install and some previous mod, and you may need to investigate that to see about overcoming that conflict.

HOWEVER, if the things mentioned in those messages are just folders, as they are in all the messages noted above, then you can safely ignore them and proceed with activating the new mod. That type of message just means some previous mod has already created that folder (so JSGME doesn't need to create it again) - the two mods are just putting different files in the same folder (which is very common with skins), so there's no problem.
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