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Stuttering after patch


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#81 Marco_._

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 06:36

I knew from the start that it isnt my soft or hardware because the sim was running fast and without issues before the 1006 patch
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#82 ZaltysZ

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 07:45

Tvrdi, can you answer to my post here: http://riseofflight....?p=30106#p30106">viewtopic.php?p=30106#p30106 ?
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#83 Marco_._

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 10:16

EDIT: tried with onboard realtek hd audio sound and stutters gone but the game is still not smooth as before the patch and my trackir is not sluggish….

Is this still true? Seems like classical IRQ problem. What motherboard do you have? Have you checked IRQ table for sharing conflicts? (yes, it is still a problem with nowadays computers). If you have Asus mainboard, you can look at manual, Asus always gives IRQ table in manual.

I have gigabyte X58 UD3R and I will check my IRQ table for conflict when i get home…btw In the meantime I bought x-fi gamer and the stutters are still there..I will try with the new patch (1007) but I doubt that they changed anything in performance…at least they didnt listed in bug fix
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#84 ZaltysZ

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 12:27

Tvrdi, I have checked manual of your mainboard and there is no IRQ table sadly. So you need to check IRQs in Device Manager. Launch it, then click View>Resource by Type and expand IRQs. Look at IRQ of your sound and video card. Then check if other devices share the same IRQ as video and sound cards.

You have said, that you have X-Fi Gamer. If I recall correctly, that card uses PCI (not PCI-E). Have you tried to use different slot? Also, don't forget to disable integrated sound.

P.S. Creative cards are little prima donnas. :) They always assumed that whole bus is almost just for them, but of course that is not always possible. In the past, IRQ sharing problems usually manifested like pops/clicks of sound, but now it is little different. Probably Creative made a "fix" via drivers.
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#85 Marco_._

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 12:41

Tvrdi, I have checked manual of your mainboard and there is no IRQ table sadly. So you need to check IRQs in Device Manager. Launch it, then click View>Resource by Type and expand IRQs. Look at IRQ of your sound and video card. Then check if other devices share the same IRQ as video and sound cards.

You have said, that you have X-Fi Gamer. If I recall correctly, that card uses PCI (not PCI-E). Have you tried to use different slot? Also, don't forget to disable integrated sound.

P.S. Creative cards are little prima donnas. :) They always assumed that whole bus is almost just for them, but of course that is not always possible. In the past, IRQ sharing problems usually manifested like pops/clicks of sound, but now it is little different. Probably Creative made a "fix" via drivers.

Zaltys thank you I will check IRQ sharing….but just a tip….I had stutters (post patch) with realtek onboard HD , with audigy se and with x-fi gamer….before the patch (1006) everything was smooth without stutters (with audigy se card)….so I doubt its IRQ related issue…..
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#86 JohnBanks

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 14:12

Too bad the latest patch doesn't fix the stutter issue. Guess everybody hoped that the next one would fix it.
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#87 Kwiatek

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 14:22

Why do people play around with drivers, and add-on graphics performance programs to fix a problem that has nothing to do with their hardware or software? :? The problem is not been caused by the latest vid drivers, nor is it your graphics settings in game, or your settings in NCP or Catalyst. Trying to fix it really is a waist of time, and rolling back drivers isnt the answer, because some of our other newer games performance will suffer because of it. They been "ROF" have admitted there is a problem, and should have it fixed next patch..COUGH…COUGH.

I coud say that i didnt change graphic drivers in 1.05 and when i got 1.06 patch initialy. So i notice worse performance using the same drivers in both patches. Yesterday i decided to change drivers for more older ones which i used some time before. I notice little better performance but still i found some problems which i wrote.
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#88 Marco_._

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 15:39

Tvrdi, I have checked manual of your mainboard and there is no IRQ table sadly. So you need to check IRQs in Device Manager. Launch it, then click View>Resource by Type and expand IRQs. Look at IRQ of your sound and video card. Then check if other devices share the same IRQ as video and sound cards.

You have said, that you have X-Fi Gamer. If I recall correctly, that card uses PCI (not PCI-E). Have you tried to use different slot? Also, don't forget to disable integrated sound.

P.S. Creative cards are little prima donnas. :) They always assumed that whole bus is almost just for them, but of course that is not always possible. In the past, IRQ sharing problems usually manifested like pops/clicks of sound, but now it is little different. Probably Creative made a "fix" via drivers.


Image

under IRQ 16 are my vga and sound card…also realtek family controller and..
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#89 ZaltysZ

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 16:17

It does not look nice. Try switching slots. At least make so that VGA and sound card won't share the same IRQ.
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#90 Marco_._

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 18:08

btw this is how "fast slideshow looks on my pc"…recorder with fraps, mission is 1vs1 offline…


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9hm7WoDevg
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#91 TX-EcoDragon

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 18:32

Why do people play around with drivers, and add-on graphics performance programs to fix a problem that has nothing to do with their hardware or software? :? The problem is not been caused by the latest vid drivers, nor is it your graphics settings in game, or your settings in NCP or Catalyst. Trying to fix it really is a waist of time, and rolling back drivers isnt the answer, because some of our other newer games performance will suffer because of it. They been "ROF" have admitted there is a problem, and should have it fixed next patch..COUGH…COUGH.

Well, there is absolutely an end user aspect to this. . .not to say the fix isn't in the hands of the developers, but those of us testing this sim have been searching for these issues and do not find them.

The problems aren't so global as to be easy to track down. We have guys running everything from overclocked i7s to 6 year old hardware who do not have "stutters" and personally I've spent dozens of hours trying different settings, different video cards, different operating systems, different patch versions, buying FFB joysticks that many people have issues with etc. and tasking our testing team to do the same.

Our fps have improved in these last two patches and stutters happen now and then as in any title, but nothing consistent.
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#92 ICDP

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 18:49

Sorry but there is absolutely an end user aspect to this. Those of us testing this sim have been searching for these issues and do not find them. We have guys running everything from overclocked i7s to 6 year old hardware who do not have "stutters" and personally I've spent dozens of hours trying different settings, different video cards, different operating systems, different patch versions, buying FFB joysticks that many people have issues with etc. and tasking our testing team to do the same.

Our fps have improved in these last two patches.

Then quite frankly you don't have enough testers. The poll that was conducted here recently showed a majority of 67% of voters had stutters after patch 1.06. My own PC has not been touched for drivers or any other setting and my performance in RoF nosedived after patch 1.06 was installed. A system that runs RoF perfectly prior to patch 1.06 all of a sudden takes a massive performance hit, with no other changes other than the update to RoF. So now the developers and the testers are saying it must be the end users? Are you seriously trying to suggest we all just coincidentally messed up our PCs at the exact same time that patch 1.06 was released?
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#93 TX-EcoDragon

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 19:07

Are you seriously trying to suggest we all just coincidentally messed up our PCs at the exact same time that patch 1.06 was released?

No that's not at all what I was trying to say - I realized it sounded like that and was editting it when you replied. :-/

The post I quoted seemed to be suggesting that we shouldn't be trying different hardware/software configurations and looking for the solution as end-users and that the answer is simply to wait for the next patch, and that this is a global problem. That hasn't been my group's experience. . .that's all.

It just makes sense to me that we keep looking, and that we keep communicating what we find on our individual machines.

Oh and I was not speaking about anyone other than TX-Squadron's testing team in my previous post.
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#94 Marco_._

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 11:44

I will tell you something….Im with neoqb (then gennadich team) from the start of this project…I gave them my money and my trust…I supported them even when they were attacked by many ppl (regarding online authentication etc)…today they f up my game with 1006 patch and at first they denied the whole stuttering/drop of performance/trackir sluggishnes thing to be a massive problem….they told me its only me and a few more ppl….now we see that at least 50% of ROF customers have a big performance issues after 1006 patch…..good and professional developers would take all of their resources to fix this FIRST….thats what a good gaming company is doin

so, I will wait till next patch then I will decide…i really dont want to waist my money and time on unprofessional ppl and their product…

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#95 3DDevil

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 12:01

Tvrd…. have you tried patch 1.007? You wont be happy…

SNIPER town…. All AI enemy planes are now SNIPERS!!..

dont know if the stutters have been fixed.. but will fly again to test…
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#96 Bear2

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 12:10

:cry: I'm ready for uninstal RoF steal my money month after month without a real improvment to the game
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#97 taleks2

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 12:17

I will tell you something….Im with neoqb (then gennadich team) from the start of this project…I gave them my money and my trust…I supported them even when they were attacked by many ppl (regarding online authentication etc)…today they f up my game with 1006 patch and at first they denied the whole stuttersing/drop of performance/trackir sluggishnes thing to be a massive problem….they told me its only me and a few more ppl….now we see that at least 50% of ROF customers have a big performance issues after 1006 patch…..good and professional developers would take all of their resources to fix this FIRST….thats what a good gaming company is doin

so, I will wait till next patch then I will decide…i really dont want to waist my money and time on unprofessional ppl and their product…
Tvrdi, with all respects, it's 1.007 already (although you probably mistyped it).

Stuttering and fps down problem (see, I'm even not calling it issue) was addressed as major during testing and beta-testing. It required additional testing in several modes (+/- TIR, +/- FF, several Windows versions and so on). I've seen at least one post with text, that stuttering was solved. Of course, it may be not fixed in your configuration, I'll not lie that all problems were eliminated, but there was huge work on this subject. I can't disclosure details, but just believe me that programmers and designers have already done and are doing much work. Hope, producer will post some official statement on some details of this work in next few days.

PS:
I'm ready for uninstal RoF steal my money month after month without a real improvment to the game
How does it steal your money from month to month?
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#98 3DDevil

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 12:53

Well I have patch 1.007 and the stuttering is WORSE with this patch and not better for me… WORSE WORSE WORSE WORSE…. AHHHHH…. game UNPLAYABLE!!!…
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#99 taleks2

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 13:05

Well I have patch 1.007 and the stuttering is WORSE with this patch and not better for me… WORSE WORSE WORSE WORSE…. AHHHHH…. game UNPLAYABLE!!!…
Ok, now I've seen at least one post with text that stuttering was not solved.
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#100 storemaster78

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 13:12

Yeah, sorry to say, that this stuttering makes it unable to play this game at least for me
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#101 MattM

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 13:34

Guys, please try this and let me know if it works for you.
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#102 Marco_._

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 15:38

I will tell you something….Im with neoqb (then gennadich team) from the start of this project…I gave them my money and my trust…I supported them even when they were attacked by many ppl (regarding online authentication etc)…today they f up my game with 1006 patch and at first they denied the whole stuttersing/drop of performance/trackir sluggishnes thing to be a massive problem….they told me its only me and a few more ppl….now we see that at least 50% of ROF customers have a big performance issues after 1006 patch…..good and professional developers would take all of their resources to fix this FIRST….thats what a good gaming company is doin

so, I will wait till next patch then I will decide…i really dont want to waist my money and time on unprofessional ppl and their product…
Tvrdi, with all respects, it's 1.007 already (although you probably mistyped it).

Stuttering and fps down problem (see, I'm even not calling it issue) was addressed as major during testing and beta-testing. It required additional testing in several modes (+/- TIR, +/- FF, several Windows versions and so on). I've seen at least one post with text, that stuttering was solved. Of course, it may be not fixed in your configuration, I'll not lie that all problems were eliminated, but there was huge work on this subject. I can't disclosure details, but just believe me that programmers and designers have already done and are doing much work. Hope, producer will post some official statement on some details of this work in next few days.


I didnt mistyped anything….drastic drop of performance started AFTER 1006 patch….I applayed 1007 patch and drop of performance (stutters, trackir slowdown etc) is still here only I can see that AI is now a friend of Vasily Zaitsev.

I tried with XP, Vista and W7…upgraded my sound card…changed gpu drivers…defragmented my disk…did clean v1006 install…nothing helped….nothing

In 1006 patch Neoqb "improved" performance in game with icons on….so they touched something in performance range! Well they did something "wrong". Since many ppl have a drastic performance dropdown after v 1006.
Here is my video…it is short and without audio…recorded with fraps while "playing" 1vs1 mission in F DvII:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=Z9hm7WoDevg">

what you see in fraps video is exactly how it performed in the game..
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#103 KrautKrusher

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 16:22

I'm having the same issue as above. As soon as Trackir is paused, performance is perfect again. I'm thinking it's either:
A) Windows 7 issue, maybe
B) A Saitek X52 issue
C) Both.
D) I'm completely wrong. But the issues are also present in FSX–not FS9 & Blackshark
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#104 The_ant

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 20:47

Well I have patch 1.007 and the stuttering is WORSE with this patch and not better for me… WORSE WORSE WORSE WORSE…. AHHHHH…. game UNPLAYABLE!!!…


:evil: Yes Same here! changed too new graphic card with the 1006 patch,and the stutter was gonne then.But now (1007)its back and its unplayable.As mentioned also why bring in vasily saitsev and könig snipers? into this game,bloody boring being shoot down in almost every imposible shooting angle all the time-And always with an instant deathblow too your face,flying around 1 sec and gonne the next micro secund,this makes the career play just down the drain or wc.Please neqb cant you make the ai shoot more like human beings,not insane good but like a normal person,that spends a few gun rounds at his target.
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#105 Del-Dredd

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 21:17

Quote "Then quite frankly you don't have enough testers. The poll that was conducted here recently showed a majority of 67% of voters had stutters after patch 1.06. My own PC has not been touched for drivers or any other setting and my performance in RoF nosedived after patch 1.06 was installed. A system that runs RoF perfectly prior to patch 1.06 all of a sudden takes a massive performance hit, with no other changes other than the update to RoF. So now the developers and the testers are saying it must be the end users? Are you seriously trying to suggest we all just coincidentally messed up our PCs at the exact same time that patch 1.06 was released"



Poor statistics, 67% sounds highish untill you look at total votes cast, which is only 88 at present, it needs everyone using ROF to vote before figures can be used reliably.

It is like most game threads, issues are voiced by those it affects, the majority who do not suffer do not post.
I have suffered with previous games as a minority with a problem, its a pain in the backside, luckily no problems with ROF yet.

They should put a Poll or something on the main game page requesting all users to vote one way or the other, only then will we know the full extent of the issue.

Del
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#106 TX-EcoDragon

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 21:30

It also doesn't specify the nature of those stutters. . .what qualifies as stutter to one person might be easily ignored by another. Some people will answer yes who might average 50 fps and have smooth play most of the time, but see momentary pausing once or twice when planes spawn/draw, while another person is seeing what Tvrdi shows in his video. . .and clearly they are two very different issues and of very different significance to gameplay.
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#107 taleks2

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Posted 27 September 2009 - 11:06

Tvrdi,
I've looked to youtube video.
May you post links to your previous posts with descriptions of your spec (all specs you've used) and what solutions have you tried?
I understand that is inconvenient (and I understand if you refuse) but may you try also, to play one usually well stuttered mission without TrackIR (plug it off from your PC, not just switch off in profile) just to check one my idea? I don't think this issue is related to graphics, more probably to input handling or resource loading.
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#108 Marco_._

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Posted 27 September 2009 - 13:17

Tvrdi,
I've looked to youtube video.
May you post links to your previous posts with descriptions of your spec (all specs you've used) and what solutions have you tried?
I understand that is inconvenient (and I understand if you refuse) but may you try also, to play one usually well stuttered mission without TrackIR (plug it off from your PC, not just switch off in profile) just to check one my idea? I don't think this issue is related to graphics, more probably to input handling or resource loading.

no problem at all…I will play one 1vs1 mission with (or without i hope) stuttering without trackir and I will post a video.

my system spec:

i7920@ 3,3Ghz (temps never beyond 62)
mbo Gigabyte X58 UDR3 rev 1.6
Scythe Katana 3 cooler
Palit gtx 275 at default clocks
x-fi gamer (tried earlier with audigy SE and realtec hd onboard sound)
4 GIGS of DDR3 1333 working on 1328 Mhz
WD C.Black,32MB,WD6401AALS
Trackir 4 pro with latgest v5 final software

resolution is 1680x1050, fullscreen (native resolution of my Dell 2209WA sips)
vsync ON

also tried with XP sp3 (32bit), Vista and Win7 RTM….stutters are in all 3 OS-es….
tried with new and old gpu drivers….tried with medium and full quality settings..tried with post effects off and on….tried with and without AA and AF and with ingame AA and AF and only with nhancer AA and AF settings….

notice: before the patch v 1006 ROF was very fast, smooth, no stutters, trackir was fast and smooth and i had high FPS…all that on Win7 :)

as soon as I will be able to make a test with unpluged trackir i will post a link and a result…

btw, now im unable to enter into my config file and cockpit view setup from ROf settings input tab….I can change inputs but i cant enter into config file….

so i did it manually…it is here…

http://rapidshare.co...80746/Tvrdi.map">http://rapidshare.co...80746/Tvrdi.map
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#109 Marco_._

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Posted 27 September 2009 - 15:08

OK I unplugged my trackir from sub slot and turned on my pc….tried the same mission 1vs1 with fokker DVII without trackir and the stutters are still there….btw, my fps fell to under 30 after patch 1006…before patch 1006 my FPS was 60+ and ROF was very smooth

video with stutters, trackir unplugged:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=fRXABt5Ve6Y">


you know,…I think performance issues are connected with the way Neoqb optimised performance in pacth 1006…they said they improved performance ingame with icons ON…well they did something that some of us (not a few mind you) have drastic loss of performance and stutters….

currently Im playing ARMA2 which is also very CPU and GPU demanding game…all settings maxed out, posteffects off, and trackir ON….the game is running fast with smooth trackir movement….so….
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#110 taleks2

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Posted 28 September 2009 - 01:27

Thanks, it seems my idea was wrong, it's not related to input locks.

As for 1.006. There were changes in graphics core, related to GUI and some graphics bugs (I don't know details as I'm not graphics programmer, one of it was fps down with icons on). Beta-testers as well as internal testers were testing both versions 1.005 and 1.006 simultaneously in order to find problems after first stuttering reports. There are other changes in graphics core now (in developers version of game), but I don't know performance results of it yet. I may assure you, that both team leads (graphics and engine core) are working on this problem. Several equipment was bought just to reproduce problem on same hardware and so on. Of course, it's not good that this problem is not eliminated yet, but it's one of first priorities now.
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#111 Marco_._

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Posted 28 September 2009 - 06:39

thank you
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#112 inferno-canada

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Posted 28 September 2009 - 17:50

Thanks, it seems my idea was wrong, it's not related to input locks.

As for 1.006. There were changes in graphics core, related to GUI and some graphics bugs (I don't know details as I'm not graphics programmer, one of it was fps down with icons on). Beta-testers as well as internal testers were testing both versions 1.005 and 1.006 simultaneously in order to find problems after first stuttering reports. There are other changes in graphics core now (in developers version of game), but I don't know performance results of it yet. I may assure you, that both team leads (graphics and engine core) are working on this problem. Several equipment was bought just to reproduce problem on same hardware and so on. Of course, it's not good that this problem is not eliminated yet, but it's one of first priorities now.
Thanks Taleks2. very nice reply. hope you can fix that as soon as you can…
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#113 O_Smiladon

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Posted 28 September 2009 - 18:09

Hi All And Salute,

I to have a stutter prob…but its a prob that i have lived with. After seeing the youtube shot i relised that it wasnot just me..

So thank you Neoqb for now acknowledging the prob now, and working on a way to fix it.

regards

RAF_Ctd_Smiladon
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#114 Killer-Ants

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Posted 28 September 2009 - 18:12

Well, I was one of the luck guys who was struck by a massive stuttering after patch 1.006… I didn't change any settings before applying the 1.006 / 1.007 patch and the game became unplayable in many occasions!

The weird thing are the stutters just show up when I try to refly the mission, and this stutter happens in a single point of view - cockpit or external - if I got FPS drops in cockpit, the external view is just fine. :(

Cheers!
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#115 Haggart85

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 00:34

Well, I was one of the luck guys who was struck by a massive stuttering after patch 1.006… I didn't change any settings before applying the 1.006 / 1.007 patch and the game became unplayable in many occasions!

The weird thing are the stutters just show up when I try to refly the mission, and this stutter happens in a single point of view - cockpit or external - if I got FPS drops in cockpit, the external view is just fine. :(

Cheers!

I was lucky…1.006 ran fine for me, the moment 1.007 rolled out I got massive stuttering. Not to the point of unplayable, just some sorties I can fly…others I can't. It is quite upsetting given how much I was enjoying the game and my contemplation of purchasing more aircraft has been dashed on the rocks since I don't really have a desire to buy aircraft if I can't fly them in the game!

Odd that you have the FPS drop in the cockpit but external is fine…for me, if the cockpit view is stuttering, then the external view is even worse.

I don't know much about computer programming or the latter, but a comparable resource hog type of game such as FSX, my PC averages mid 30s for FPS, with relatively little slow downs (only in HUGE cities it seems). I don't have any clue where this stuttering type of behavior comes from with RoF, perhaps someone could enlighten me?
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#116 =IRFC=AirBiscuit

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 01:35

Stuttering has been significantly reduced for me by:

1) Defraging file system which ROF was installed on.

2) Eliminating all but essential processes via msconfig.

3) Dropping my video resolution down to single-monitor dimensions.

The game is actually rather playable now, altho I still experience some stutters from time to time. They are generally not nearly as bad as what I had immediately after 1.006, tho. Just after that patch, the game would grind down to single digit framerates for no apparent reason in the roulette missions.
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http://quetoo.org


#117 Marco_._

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 06:44

guys, the problem is that it seams that I dont have only a problem with stuttering…I have a big loss of performance…If you take a look at my video you can see that periodically I experienced something which can be described as "fast slideshow"…then FPS drops to under 30 and the game is literally unplayable just like I have a rig 7 years old….

at least strange….
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#118 famich

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 07:35

Hello, for the first time posting here on this sad occasion :)
I ve had some stuttering after the 1006 update, but, as you can guess, I got a massive stutter now after the 1007 update.

I got i920@4.0GHZ fully stable, 6G DDR3 Nvidia 295 GTX ASUS Xonar DX audio. All other games are running smoothly .I have suspected the Saitek X52 drivers, as I ve had some probs on W 7 7100 build with them… I have installed ROF ona WIN XP SP 3 as well, but the stuttering is the same .

EIther Saitek + ROF are not friends, or the game same is to blame…. :mrgreen:
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#119 =IRFC=AirBiscuit

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 12:20

Tvrdi, to be perfectly honest, it didn't look that bad. My system used to actually do something much more pronounced than what you're seeing.

Still, I would be annoyed at your problem too. But "unplayable" is an overstatement. At least, in my opinion.

famich, defragment your hard drive. The ROF update process (e.g. 1.006 -> 1.007) can result in some pretty significant fragmentation. Apparently, because of the sheer size of the media required by this game, ROF will continually load bits of data from your disk. If the main data files for ROF have fragmentation, this can lead to degraded performance.

Hope this helps,
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#120 Marco_._

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 19:46

Tvrdi, to be perfectly honest, it didn't look that bad. My system used to actually do something much more pronounced than what you're seeing.

Still, I would be annoyed at your problem too. But "unplayable" is an overstatement. At least, in my opinion.

you must be kiddin…how do you expect me to play ROF in "fast slideshow mode"?! Take a look at my video again please….
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