SPAD VII of Adj. Roger Guillaumot, N3, 1917
Posted 10 September 2011 - 16:35
Reference: Jon Guttman - Groupe de combat 12 "Les Cigognes"
DOWNLOAD V3 (updated colors):
http://www.mediafire...30gvwayaxcwaawb" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.mediafire...30gvwayaxcwaawb
Posted 10 September 2011 - 16:36
Something something SPAD. Something something then dive away.
Posted 10 September 2011 - 16:44
You can vote my post up by clicking the green arrow on the right.
Posted 10 September 2011 - 17:08
Yes for me…
Posted 10 September 2011 - 20:33
His Spad VII was named "Ma Renée", and the stork was all red.
"Spad VII du Lieutenant Roger Guillaumot en 1917 - La cigogne peinte sur le fuselage est entièrement rouge - Photo Musée de l'Air et de l'Espace du Bourget -
Ltt Roger Guillaumot - pilote de l'escadrille N 3 - Né le 14 juillet 1894 à Paris (75) - Arme d'origine : aviation comme mécanicien à Villacoublay - Brevet de pilote militaire n° 911 en date du 8 mai 1915 - Formé à l'école de Tours - Pau - Avord - Escadrilles F 1 - N 3 - A l'escadrille 3 de 23 septembre 1916 au 1er juin 1918 - 4 citations."
You can find it here: http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escadrille/escadrille003.htm
Can't find any pict of hole plane though.
I'm pretty sure there isn't many others Guillaumot in this escadrille imo
EDIT: i found other document saying Spad VII S420 of Roger Guillaumot coded N°13 fuselage had red stork on fuselage.
About the number 13 on top wing…i'm not sure there is one though (see old pict above). I would say only on fuselage. But maybe you have a better proof than me of that?
Posted 11 September 2011 - 10:18
If it is, I'll make the corrections (open side and red stork + weathering) - are you sure there wasn't a number on the top wing? Do you think it was only Guynemer? We can only guess but it seems more logical to have one. What do you think? I'll check my sources.
Thank you for the info!
Posted 11 September 2011 - 10:30
Unfortunately, it's the only picture i have of "Ma Renée" plane.
About red stork, you'll find it here: http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escadrille/Societe_SPAD.htm
The list is long, but find Spad S420! —> "cigogne rouge"
About top wing numbers, not many had them imo. It was mainly on fuselage (and top fuselage too).
Check your sources and we'll compare!
Posted 11 September 2011 - 11:38
I found a close up picture of S420 and the cigogne was white/black. and I found another photo too.
I'm also quite positive that most planes had a number on the top wing.
Posted 11 September 2011 - 11:44
Btw nice to see the black stains of the exhaust smoke..
Posted 11 September 2011 - 12:01
About Guillaumot, it is a common mistake. His name was Roger indeed, and the name "Renée" painted on his SPAD refer to a female person. Maybe his girlfriend?
René is a man name, Renée the name of a woman.
Last thing, about the number of the top wing, you can't be sure, unless you have a photo.
For example, the plane of René Dorme SPAD VII S392 180HP of Sous-Lt René Dorme, N3,April-May 1917 doesn't have a number on the top wing. But Guynemer's has.
EDIT: it's not a different SPAD, it is a repainted one.
Posted 11 September 2011 - 12:05
I updated the DL link:
Now it says "Roger" and I also removed the louvers. On page 53 I found a picture that proves that the louvers were removed.
The stains are there in the stock template.
Posted 11 September 2011 - 16:30
Posted 11 September 2011 - 19:43
For the pilot first name, if you google Roger (french pages) you'll find it as WW1 pilot on few sites. Nothing for René, except some english sites! So i'm guessing english are making the mistake for his first name…maybe due to the plane name "Renée"
As JJ said, stork color changed with WW1 time line, so it's not really a surprise this plane had the red stork firstly, and the black and white a bit later.
Anyway i prefer the look of the black and white!
I still believe this plane didn't have any top wing number. Apart Guynemer one, i never saw an other french one. Top wing numbers were mainly used by americans and british imo.
But i can be wrong
If i was you, i would let the top wing number unless we get the proof there wasn't one…
Anyway, that's a beautiful skin Greg! I love your beige color, as your others.
Posted 16 September 2011 - 13:26
http://www.ipmsstock...rofile_spad.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.ipmsstock....org/magazine/2 … e_spad.htm
Pessi's regular Spad VII carried typical French yellow finish. Metal surfaces were painted with chrome yellow lacquer (based on lead chromate PbCrO4 pigment), and fabric surfaces were painted with chrome yellow cellulose lacquer with an addition of aluminium powder. The latter mixture (58% of lead chromate versus 42% of aluminium powder) was subtly darker, less vivid and a bit greener than pure "metal" version of chrome yellow. The effect was amplified by the poor quality of aluminium powder which was greyer and less shiny than it is nowadays.
This is lead chromate:
So I updated all of my skins accordingly:
Posted 16 September 2011 - 13:45
Posted 20 September 2011 - 20:14
maybee its for you only marginal…
i dont vote yet… because, (acording photo of tail of this plane in "Les Cigones"by Osprey)
"3" have diferent shape(check upper part of 3circle,
real "S" on ruder was more circular,
and description "spad hispano…etc" was smaller and slightly lower on ruder…
Posted 07 October 2011 - 07:03
What are you going to decide Greg?
Posted 07 October 2011 - 07:06
So, no changes for red stork even if we see it on old picture? (we clearly see it's not a black and white stork) and even with Albin Denis text references?…
What are you going to decide Greg?
Fifi, I found a picture of this machine where both the serial number and a black and white stork are clearly visible. It looks like the stork was repainted at some point.
Posted 07 October 2011 - 07:22
By the way, shouldn't it be closed already?
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