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Stuttering after 1.021 Update


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#81 arjisme

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:06

RoF will save a screenshot in the game root directory every time you press print screen.
To capture the settings screenshots like I posted, that won't work. ;) Well, actually it will, but it will capture your entire desktop too.
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#82 HotTom

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:10

EDIT: HAD TO SWITCH A PIC. OK NOW.

Catalyst Driver Version 11.7

Attached File  Capture.JPG   83.8KB   221 downloadsAttached File  AMD Settings 2.JPG   83.42KB   238 downloads

Attached Files


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#83 arjisme

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:13

What version of Catalyst drivers are you using HT (under Information->Software)?
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#84 HotTom

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:27

What version of Catalyst drivers are you using HT (under Information->Software)?


11.7 but I'm going to update to 11.8 now that I know it's available.

Had to edit previous pics.

Correct now. Notice AA and AF are application controlled, both at 8x.
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#85 AndrewHart

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:34

Hi .. You AMD control center is called Vision Control .. and looks different to my AMD Catalyst Centre .. Is that coz we have different cards ?
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#86 AndrewHart

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:36

EDIT – I have a section called Smooth Vision (very odd)
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#87 HotTom

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:38

Hi .. You AMD control center is called Vision Control .. and looks different to my AMD Catalyst Centre .. Is that coz we have different cards ?

Who are you talking to?

"You" is kinda general :mrgreen:
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#88 SYN_Mike77

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:40

Thanks to those lucky s.o.b.'s who have ati and no probs for posting your ati settings. I will check those vs mine when I get home.
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#89 HotTom

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 17:43

Well, I quit smoking about 10 years ago…but, when I have computer problems, the first thing I do is go out and buy a pack of cigarettes to calm me down so I don't throw the whole rig out the window.

It's very frustrating. You definitely have my sympathy.
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#90 AndrewHart

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 18:03

Sorry HotTom .. Was referring to your screen shots of the AMD control Centre – Your version looks very different to mine and i'm using 11.7 – so just wondered if the control centre software was card specific?
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#91 HotTom

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 18:09

Sorry HotTom .. Was referring to your screen shots of the AMD control Centre – Your version looks very different to mine and i'm using 11.7 – so just wondered if the control centre software was card specific?

Ah, okay, didn't want to give you info you didn't want :mrgreen:

I think mine is the latest control center. They keep renaming stuff at AMD. I get the new control center every month with new drivers.

I get the drivers and control center for Win 7 64 bit. I don't think they are card-specific, though.
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#92 blairgowrie

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 18:41

DOWNLOADED LATEST PATCH GETTING BAD STUTTERING, TRIED ABOVE FIXES NO CHANGE MY SYSTEM WINDOWS XP ATI RADEON HD 5400 CARD, QUAD CORE AMD PHENON 11 X 4 840 PROCESSORS , ATI POWER SUPPLY, 4 G DDR3 MEMORY, ASHROCK N68C-S MOTHERBOARD, 1TB HARD DRIVE ANY IDEAS ?
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#93 HotTom

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 18:56

DOWNLOADED LATEST PATCH GETTING BAD STUTTERING, TRIED ABOVE FIXES NO CHANGE MY SYSTEM WINDOWS XP ATI RADEON HD 5400 CARD, QUAD CORE AMD PHENON 11 X 4 840 PROCESSORS , ATI POWER SUPPLY, 4 G DDR3 MEMORY, ASHROCK N68C-S MOTHERBOARD, 1TB HARD DRIVE ANY IDEAS ?

Must be your Caps Lock key. Try unlocking it :mrgreen:

FWIW, updated to 11.8 drivers. Still no problems.
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#94 Aiobhill

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 19:10

Sorry HotTom .. Was referring to your screen shots of the AMD control Centre – Your version looks very different to mine and i'm using 11.7 – so just wondered if the control centre software was card specific?

CC has a "preferences" button in the upper right. There you can switch between advanced view and standard view. You want advanced view to be able to access all driver options.
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#95 SYN_Mike77

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 20:05

ok, some level of success. I noticed on my catalyst settings I had (and always had as far as I know) adaptive anti aisling un checked and anti aisling on full quality. I noticed that the guys who posted thier settings either had mid level or full performance. So I enabled adaptive anit aisling and moved the slider to full performance. That helped. I then started to play around with RoF settings and when I turn shadows off and keep the above setting in Catalyst the stuttering nearly stops. Just a few stutters on take off and then it is smooth. So for me it has gone from a game killer to an annoyance. The above test were all in qmb with a 1 v 1 match up. Frame rates are higher than I have ever seen before and core usage is lower on all 4 and it runs cooler.
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#96 arjisme

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 20:24

Sounds promising, Mike!
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#97 ChiefRedCloud

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 20:58

The fact that AMD haven't responded to Jason's emails is irrelevant. It worked before, they changed something, now it doesn't, change it back.

Simples :)
I'm going to stick my hand out here and most likely get it bit but, I take it your a programmer and know well what these devs have to do to pull all this together for us right? IF you are, then you should understand. IF your not then you need grow some patience and just a wee bit of understanding here.

The Devs are NOT pulling a Mel Gibson (aka Conspiracy Therory)on you here and most of the people are trying to help you ( and others) come to grips with this.

See the smiley? That means the associated post is in jest. Most of my posts on this subject have been trying to be helpfull, admittedly with a large smattering of sarcasm and frustration at times.

I am a firm believer in "cock-up before conspiracy". Simply put it seems like the devs made changes that helped SLI (and potentially Crossfire) users, they did this with the best intentions. Unfortunately the net effect of whatever they changed is that lots of stutter and broken overcast for many (not all) AMD/ATI users.

I don't need to be a programmer to know that my HD6970 worked great with 1.020, now it doesn't. The only change on my system is RoF update 1.021. I do have faith that the devs will fix the issue, in the meantime I wil continue testing and reporting anything I might think is helpfull from those tests.

Good enough …… and I appoligise for not recognising your humour or sarcasim ;) <—- seeing as I really like sarcasim …… 8-)
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#98 =IRFC=JIGiles

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 21:26

No stuttering here with an NVidia GTX 460. In fact, its a huge improvement. I can now run 1920x1080, up from 1280x720. I do have frame rate limited to 50 fps and haven't tried changing that. And I'm operating only dual core under W7. Cudos!

I do think i've found a non-graphics bug however. I'll report it in another thread.
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#99 Joker_BR

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 21:54

<offtrack>
Sadly I was hoping to get the 1.020 back on my drive to play it offline until this 1.021 problems were fixed, but after installing it again I got a message stating that there is an update and I'm forced to do it before I can play (even trying to login offline).
I didn't like this "feature" (ok, it may happen - I believe - only when you're logging in for the first time) but nevertheless you can't compare versions anymore (I was planning to "measure" the difference between the two versions), not to mention the situation were sometime in the future a new patch will end introducing a feature that your hardware won't support anymore, and you won't be able to play again until upgrading your rig, because reverting to last version to play offline will be denied.

And yes, I tried to copy the "account".dat from the 1.021 install, to no avail.
</offtrack>
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#100 CAFulcrum

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 22:21

I'll post my settings as well. Not getting any stuttering today in a few N17 career missions. Last night I noticed a moment of stuttering as I approached a DFW, and in outside view after landing. I do get stuttering still in QMB when I go to F5 view of ground vehicles or when on the ground. Otherwise the sim runs just swell.

Edit: I have multiGPU/SLI checked as the sime runs smoother with it enabled. Without it on I haven't noticed any stuttering at all, but because the stuttering doesn't really affect gameplay I have it turned on.

11.8 Drivers, ATI HD4870

Attached Files

  • Attached File  set3.JPG   64.73KB   184 downloads
  • Attached File  set2.JPG   65.61KB   184 downloads
  • Attached File  set4.JPG   49.73KB   184 downloads
  • Attached File  set1.JPG   73.61KB   184 downloads

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#101 Jason_Williams

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 00:13

Everyone with ATI see this thread.

Attention ATI Users - Test Settings

Jason
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#102 Panthercules

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 00:26

<offtrack>
Sadly I was hoping to get the 1.020 back on my drive to play it offline until this 1.021 problems were fixed, but after installing it again I got a message stating that there is an update and I'm forced to do it before I can play (even trying to login offline).
I didn't like this "feature" (ok, it may happen - I believe - only when you're logging in for the first time) but nevertheless you can't compare versions anymore (I was planning to "measure" the difference between the two versions), not to mention the situation were sometime in the future a new patch will end introducing a feature that your hardware won't support anymore, and you won't be able to play again until upgrading your rig, because reverting to last version to play offline will be denied.

And yes, I tried to copy the "account".dat from the 1.021 install, to no avail.
</offtrack>

Well, you can actually protect yourself in this fashion, but you have to think about doing it ahead of time (and you need a fair amount of extra disk space, which fortunately has gotten dirt cheap these days). It's probably too late to think about it after you've already updated your previous version.

As a matter of routine, I always make a copy of each version of the game, just after updating it to a new version and logging in on-line with the new version (I don't retain them all - I only keep the copy of the immediately prior version and ditch the earlier versions as they age off). I started doing this so I could more easily test/review all the skins I create or process prior to submission to 777, without messing up my main "gaming copy" skins installation, but it also gives me a prior version to revert back to in case a new update messes something up for me. If it does, then I can still play on the old version, at least as long as I log in off-line, without being told I need to update it to the new version.

I haven't had to actually use my back-up copies that way yet (knock on wood), but it's nice to know I could if I needed to, until the devs got around to solving whatever was giving me grief about the newest release or I figured out how to work around it with changed settings or whatever.
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#103 DidNotFinish

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 03:53

Everyone with ATI see this thread.

Attention ATI Users - Test Settings

Jason

Good to see it's being looked at thoroughly. I will test it as soon as possible in the coming days.
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#104 boogar

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 07:09

I am haveing the stuttering some but not very much at all only on the carrer mode and in winter,with heavy clouds and rain,snow.It happens high up or low to the ground that is the same.It will only happen with alot heavy clouds and weather effects going on when I run into a lot of enemy aircraft at one time.
I must be lucky I do not have this issue much and only in carrer mode for me.
It was happening some befor the last update 1.021 and I have seen it 1 or 2 time in the short amount of time I have had to run my sim today.
I have most setting maxed with only 38% of the memory on my video card used and have tried to turn them down but it is the same stutter.
I run around 60fps and it is the same if I limit it to 5ofps so I just go with 60.
I know they will fix this issue soon I have run this sim along time and it has been one of the best updated sims I have ever had.Not one sim or game of any kind has even come close to the support and performance you will get from the team that made this sim.
It has been worth the wait to get to where it is now and for me it only gets better in everyway.
Phenom II X6@3.3, 16 gigs ddr3 1600 hyperx ram, Gigabyte ga-990xa-ud3 board, Evga gtx560ti 2gb video card, Xfx 750wt power supply, Acer 23" @1920x1080, Windows 7 64 bit..
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#105 Trav194

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 07:52

Im gettin stuttering also here's a screen of my settings.
AMD Phenom™IIx61055T processor
AMD radeon 6850
SamsungHD103SJ ATA
8 Gig ram

Attached Files


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#106 TomTheRedBaron

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 08:17

Everyone with ATI see this thread.

Attention ATI Users - Test Settings

Jason


I managed to fix the stuttering problems, but with slightly different ATI settings than suggested here….especially shaders from max to high seems to fit for my specs…havent tested heavy weather with numerous planes in the air yet, but I think it all should be fine. online works perfectly again.


Anyway, thank you Jason and team for your quick response and great support ! Communication is a great thing.

Intel I-5 Quad 2500K 3,3 Ghz
ATI HD 6850
4GB DDR2
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#107 Jono

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 11:29

:-( I installed 11.8 catalyst and drivers so that I could troubleshoot the stuttering with the latest driver and now my system is unservicable for all but the simplest applications. Using a ATIHD 4850. I guess this is no loger a problem for your team since it is a system issue. But i will advise folks not to mess with system files you know work well unless ROF is worth risking the stability of your system for.

Also guys dont forget to test with clouds aswell as in clear conditions. i managed to fix the stutter in clear conditions but it was still very bad (unplayable) in overcast cloud.

oh well…i hope fixing my system doesnt take all day… - i've exams coming up -(
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#108 Jono

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 13:17

ok managed to roll back to 11.4 driver. not sure what happened ther. dunno if it was a corrupt download or what. scared the crap out of me tho. few times couldnt get the system to boot.

does RoF require 11.8 driver from ATI?
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#109 AndrewHart

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 13:29

I had stuttering on 11.7 … so i installed 11.8 … Still get Stuttering
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#110 wrong_name_416

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 16:11

this is weird …it seems i am the only ATI user with no stutters at all .

only thing is when i use AMD optimization i get less fps (+-30) right now i get average off 50 with almost everything on max .


Image
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#111 Joker_BR

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 20:36

Hm, I'm beginning to see a sub-pattern here: high end CPU users aren't feeling stutters like average ones… perhaps the problem isn't related *only* to AMD GPUs, but rather to a combination of these cards and average/low CPUs. Perhaps the game is using new/more complex calculations behind the scenes than it was when in 1.020 version?
Anyway, will try with the Multi-GPU checkmark enabled and see if this helps (read about people using it even having only one GPU card installed).
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#112 Joker_BR

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 21:49

Last trials:

Q6600@2.8Ghz, 5850, 1920x1080, trackir5, Win7 x64.

Playing a track of a dogfight with 5 planes, with these settings:
Attached File  RoFsettings.jpg   231.4KB   456 downloads

Also, sound options in 128 and high, and CCC using default options.
With the settings above, my CPU was running without problems:
Attached File  taskmngr.jpg   320.18KB   456 downloads

and the average FPS was between 35 and 60 all the time, with GPU peak at 65%:
Attached File  Afterburner.jpg   95.61KB   456 downloads

Similar results in good or bad time (clear skies or raining).
Before 1.021 I was getting more or less this same FPS using supersampling at 2xAA only (to remove shimmering) and 10 light sources. Now it's impossible to activate supersampling without incurring in heavy stutters.
The two settings that seems to interfere the most are (obviously) supersampling and shaders.

EDIT: Multi-GPU checked generated more stutters for me.
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#113 AndrewHart

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Posted 03 September 2011 - 10:43

There is something very wrong about all this. I'm being lead to believe that my fairly low performance ATI Radeon 5450 with 3GB on board memory is the reason i'm getting stuttering.. Sure ! it's not a top notch card but it was working perfectly up till now. I've just turned my screen resolution to 800X600 4:3 and also turned every conceivable setting to low …AND I STILL GET STUTTER !!!
I just cannot accept that the enhancements in 1.021 are so advanced that it warrants a purchase of a new GPU … and even if I do buy a new GPU, there is no gurantee that it will stop the stutter … I'm seeing guys on this string with better performing cards but still suffering… I'm hoping the Developers are working hard to fix this… Gripe over !!!
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#114 arjisme

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Posted 03 September 2011 - 14:33

Has someone from 777 drawn a conclusion and stated that low end cards need to be replaced with more capable cards now? I am not aware of anything like that. At the moment, they are simply trying to understand the problem. Once they have a good grip on what the problem is, they can work on a solution. I seriously doubt they are going to tell existing RoF customers that they now have to upgrade their hardware to continue playing RoF. I think you're overreacting, Pandy.
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#115 Joker_BR

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Posted 03 September 2011 - 14:57

Devs need time to figure it out, these things aren't so easy/quick to discover/fix. This is expected now and then when we have an always evolving product. The solution will come out eventually, meantime, just fly with lower settings.
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#116 D.Smith

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Posted 04 September 2011 - 03:42

Devs need time to figure it out, these things aren't so easy/quick to discover/fix. This is expected now and then when we have an always evolving product. The solution will come out eventually, meantime, just fly with lower settings.

Lower settings? are you kidding? The annoying stutter is just as bad on my previous lower settings as on MSAA with everything maxed except. As far as I am concerned the game is not worth playing now and if I had started with v1.021 as the free demo I would not have bought it based on the current :roll: performance.
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#117 Jason_Williams

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Posted 04 September 2011 - 04:32

There is something very wrong about all this. I'm being lead to believe that my fairly low performance ATI Radeon 5450 with 3GB on board memory is the reason i'm getting stuttering.. Sure ! it's not a top notch card but it was working perfectly up till now. I've just turned my screen resolution to 800X600 4:3 and also turned every conceivable setting to low …AND I STILL GET STUTTER !!!
I just cannot accept that the enhancements in 1.021 are so advanced that it warrants a purchase of a new GPU … and even if I do buy a new GPU, there is no gurantee that it will stop the stutter … I'm seeing guys on this string with better performing cards but still suffering… I'm hoping the Developers are working hard to fix this… Gripe over !!!

You need to stop the drama Pandy. It's not helping the situation. We're working on it. No one is asking you to dump your system and build a new one.

I suggest you try a re-install to a different folder and make sure you re-install all the Microsoft Libraries including Direct X. Then update ROF to 1.021 and then set all your settings to low and work your way up from that until you get stutters or slow performance.

We can't troubleshoot everyone's system, but help us eliminate the possibility of something in your old install before we convince ourselves that this stutter problem is all our code. Based on the wide variety of reporting so far, something is not playing nice with some, but not all ATI cards.

In situations like this the only way to solve the problem is to have drama and crying kept to a minimum and work together to build a picture so we can find a solution. Help us help you. This kind of crap happens in game development, you have to take the good with the bad for us to make your sim better.

Jason
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#118 Jason_Williams

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Posted 04 September 2011 - 06:22

Ok guys,

I built myself an ATI system today and I can confirm that I get the stutters too and they are obvious. These are different than any others I have experience and they are very strange. We've never had such a problem before with single cards. So this tells me that something really odd is happening. We don't know what the cause is yet obviously. If only ATI would talk to us. Grrr….

However all is not lost, try the following. Lock your framerate to 30 in the ROF Settings and check on Multi-GPU even if you have a single card. I was able to acheive a smooth, playable, stutter-free picture during a QMB with 6 planes at low altitude doing this. Parrallax mapping seems to currently cause some very small micro-stutters right near the ground still. This also happens with NVIDIA cards with their latest drivers so we are aware of that already.

Keep your ATI settings at benign deafult settings to not add any more stress to ROF rendering.

I'm running 11.8 drivers.

My system is:
Intel i7 920 at 3.2 GHZ
6GB RAM
ATI 6770
Sound Blaster X-Fi
7200 RPM HDD 2TB

In Game Settings are:

Attached File  ROF_Settings_ATI.jpg   140.52KB   249 downloads

I'm going to do more testing, but the problem seems to be related to your framerate. Or perhaps the CPU is clogging up and limiting FPS helps unclog it. Who knows, but Sergey and Viks in the office are working on it this week.

As soon as we know more I'll post.

Jason
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#119 JoeCrow

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Posted 04 September 2011 - 06:26

Thanks for the response Jason. I'll give it a try.

ATI 5850.
Phenom 955BEx4 @3.2Ghz.
Asus M4a87TD EVO.

I get stutters even when the card is churning out ~50fps at ground level (external view).
I have tried lowering the resolution, and all manner of frame limiting and settings. Oddly, if I gradually crank up the resolution and settings it does not seriously hit the fps but the stuttering worsens.

Rolling the drivers all the way back to 11.4 almost eliminates the stutter but not completely.
Cheers.
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#120 JoeCrow

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Posted 04 September 2011 - 07:27

However all is not lost, try the following. Lock your framerate to 30 in the ROF Settings and check on Multi-GPU even if you have a single card. I was able to acheive a smooth, playable, stutter-free picture during a QMB with 6 planes at low altitude doing this. Parrallax mapping seems to currently cause some very small micro-stutters right near the ground still. This also happens with NVIDIA cards with their latest drivers so we are aware of that already.

Keep your ATI settings at benign deafult settings to not add any more stress to ROF rendering.

I'm running 11.8 drivers.

Jason


I've just tried it and it works perfectly. Low dogfight over Verdun, 6v6. No trace of stutters on these settings:Attached File  30fps.PNG   262.8KB   247 downloads

Thanks.
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