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Project #2 - List of all Operational Aircraft in WWI


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#1 Jason_Williams

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 11:08

Ok for our next project I'd like to really find out how many combat aircraft there were in WWI? I've seen a lot of lists for fighters, but I want to include recon, bombers, seaplanes etc. This includes variants such as SPAD VII, SPAD XII, SPAD XIII etc.

Of course, we probably just want to count the ones that saw action or were considered operational and maybe consider small batches of important prototypes that maybe flew in limited numbers an example that comes to mind is the Fokker D.VI . But no one-offs or birds that failed to reach any kind of production. Please no experimental planes with 5 wings.

As we did with the Navigation Info in Project #1, I want to create another spreadsheet that organizes all this data which will be used as the basis for a database or informational tool for ROF fans or WWI Fans in general.

Let's list the Plane's Designation, Country of Origin, Builder and Specs.

For Specs please try to use only reliable and recognized printed sources. Some performance specs will be open to debate due to unreliable sources, but be reasonable. If nasty arguments break out over this stuff I will ban offenders. Be objective and open to new info.

Then in a future project we'll work on placing them in history with what sqaudrons used them and where they could be found at the front. My future goal is to create a snapshot of the airwar on any given day or week of the war.

Again, the first step is to gather the data only, then we'll worry about what cool things we can build with it.

Who's with me?

Jason
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#2 J2_Adam

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 11:16

Hey Jason, here is one that doesn't get mentioned but was produced and delivered in higher numbers that some other planes.

I've already posted this once before in another thread but….

http://webpages.char...tten_fokker.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://webpages.char...net/hel0695/for … fokker.htm
http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Fokker_D.V" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Fokker_D.V

Fokker DV

Country: Central

General characteristics
Crew: one
Length: 6.05 m (19 ft 10 in)
Wingspan: 8.75 m (28 ft 9 in)
Height: 2.30 m (7 ft 6 in)
Wing area: 15.5 m² (167 ft²)
Empty weight: 363 kg (800 lb)
Gross weight: 566 kg (1,248 lb)
Powerplant: 1 × Oberursel U.I rotary, 82 kW (110 hp)
Performance
Maximum speed: 170 km/h (106 mph)
Range: 240 km (149 miles)
Service ceiling: 3,900 m (12,795 ft)
Rate of climb: 2.6 m/s (520 ft/min)
Armament
1 × 7.92 mm (.312 in) LMG 08/15 machine gun
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#3 No43_Moggy

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 11:48

I'll pitch in with a very important but overlooked aircraft for the RFC, the Sopwith 1½ Strutter.

Designation: Sopwith 1½ Strutter
Country of origin: United Kingsom
Builder: Sopwith Aviation Co. Ltd.
Specs:
Image
Image

Source: Profile Publications No.121, The Sopwith 1½ Strutter

Sopwith 1½ Strutter

If need be, I can go to the National Archives in Kew and research more information.

National Archives
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#4 Karma-Police

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 12:43

I agree to dress the list of operational Austro Hugarian planes.

But I'll not able to give you the rate of climb for all planes…
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#5 WF2

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 13:04

Siemens Schuckert DIII & IV, very good plane out classes a Fokker D.vII and interesting engine prop combo for RoF sim. High altitude interceptor too, could catch the 2-seaters and bombers.

Image
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#6 WF2

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 13:29

Gotha G.I - G.V for the up and coming German bomber, some info.

ImageImage
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#7 WF2

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 13:32

Bristrol M.I very overlooked plane with great speed and maneuvering.

Image
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#8 WF2

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 13:47

Roland C.II a great 2 seater an a potent adversary, fighters avoided it ! …. but landings, a real killer!

Image
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#9 WF2

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 13:54

Junkers Monoplanes J.I - J.II & Figther the Junk. J9/D.I …. just because they would be fun!

Image
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#10 Avaxus

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 15:42

FRENCH
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...ers_France.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ers_France.html
Floatplanes-> http://www.wwiaviati...nes_France.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...nes_France.html

CP
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...ers_german.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ers_german.html
Floatplanes-> http://www.wwiaviati...ral_powers.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...om/float-planes … owers.html
Flying boats-> http://www.wwiaviati...ats-german.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ats-german.html

BRITISH
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...rs_British.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...rs_British.html
Floatplanes-> http://www.wwiaviati...es_Britian.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...es_Britian.html
Flying boats-> http://www.wwiaviati...ts-british.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ts-british.html

RUSSIA
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...ers_Russia.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ers_Russia.html
Flying boats-> http://www.wwiaviati...ts-russian.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ts-russian.html
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#11 Dutch2

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 16:21

Jason, keep in your mind and do not forget you need also the sales from the plane store. So why making a expensive plane that does not sell. In this case, check were is the biggest market for the plane sales, if this is Russia then, I would go for new planes that saw action in Russia. As a sample: I prefer to see more Belgium planes, like the Hanriot, but I think this market is to small to make any profit on a plane design.

Another point: To reduce design cost, I would go for somekind of modulair system, you know give the Fokker Dr1 two wings and it is a Fokker DVI. Enlarge the DVII and you build the 2 seater Fokker V38 [C1], yeh why not. And there are more planes, build with the same components.

Please considder this is not as critism, I only want to help to make more profit on this fine game.
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If I wrote something in this forum that is hurting or abuse a member, organisation or country? Let me know by pm for the corrections, please do not react back by bashing/trolling/flaming or other personal attacks!

Yep I’m an 2009 Rof pre-order buyer and one of the few that did buy the Sikorsky game.

#12 Jason_Williams

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 18:00

Jason, keep in your mind and do not forget you need also the sales from the plane store. So why making a expensive plane that does not sell. In this case, check were is the biggest market for the plane sales, if this is Russia then, I would go for new planes that saw action in Russia. As a sample: I prefer to see more Belgium planes, like the Hanriot, but I think this market is to small to make any profit on a plane design.

Another point: To reduce design cost, I would go for somekind of modulair system, you know give the Fokker Dr1 two wings and it is a Fokker DVI. Enlarge the DVII and you build the 2 seater Fokker V38 [C1], yeh why not. And there are more planes, build with the same components.

Please considder this is not as critism, I only want to help to make more profit on this fine game.

Dutch,

This thread has nothing to do with selling or building planes. It's just a data gathering excercise so we can make some kind of interesting proggy or tool for folks who love WWI Aviation History. We can then see how to apply such data to ROF.

Jason
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#13 Jason_Williams

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 18:02

FRENCH
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...ers_France.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ers_France.html
Floatplanes-> http://www.wwiaviati...nes_France.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...nes_France.html

CP
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...ers_german.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ers_german.html
Floatplanes-> http://www.wwiaviati...ral_powers.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...om/float-planes … owers.html
Flying boats-> http://www.wwiaviati...ats-german.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ats-german.html

BRITISH
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...rs_British.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...rs_British.html
Floatplanes-> http://www.wwiaviati...es_Britian.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...es_Britian.html
Flying boats-> http://www.wwiaviati...ts-british.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ts-british.html

RUSSIA
Bombers-> http://www.wwiaviati...ers_Russia.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ers_Russia.html
Flying boats-> http://www.wwiaviati...ts-russian.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...ts-russian.html

Yes, something like this is kind of the direction I'm heading, but I want to put all this into a spreadsheet and create a database of plane info.

Jason
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#14 Interloper

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 18:21

I understand this plane may not exactly be meeting your criteria, but I thought I would post it anyway. Enjoy!

Martinsyde F.4 Buzzard

First Flight: May 1918
Power: Hispano-Suiza 300hp V-8 piston engine
Armament: Two forward firing synchronized 7.7mm/0.303in machine guns
Size: Wingspan - 9.99m/32ft 9.5in
Length - 7.77m/25ft 5.75 in
Height - 3.15m/10ft 4in
Wing Area - 29.73m2/320sq ft
Weights: Empty - 776kg/1710lb
Maximum take-off - 1038kg/2289lb
Performance: Maximum Speed - 233kph/145mph
Ceiling - 7620m/25,000ft
Range - 2 hours, 30 minutes endurance
Climb - 3050m/10000ft in 7 minutes, 54 seconds

The Martinsyde F.4 Buzzard was the production version of the F.3. The performance and handling displayed in the tests carried out by the Royal Air Force were so good that large scale production was ordered right away. 1450 aircaft were ordered but only a handful were delivered to the RAF before the end of the war due to engine delivery delays. The end of the War meant the cancellation of the order. Approximately 370 F.4s had been completed by Martinsyde. Although it never saw combat it is considered one of the best fighters of the WWI period.
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#15 SYN_Vander

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 19:40

Since this can be a huge project, ppl should be able to add new entries directly. How about something like this?

http://spreadsheets....d=0&output=html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://spreadsheets....le.com/pub?key= … utput=html

Please add your aircraft in the spreadsheet directly! :)

I think regular copies will have to be made in case of abuse…
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#16 Avaxus

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 19:41

Zeppelin-Staaken R.VI

Engines: 4 x Maybach MbIV 6-cyl. in-line, 183 kW (245 hp) each
or
4 x Mercedes DIVa 6-cyl. in-line, 194 kW (260 hp) each
Height: 6.3 m (20 ft 8 in)
Length: 22.1 m (72 ft 6 in)
Wing span: 42.2 m (138 ft 5.5 in)
Wing surface: 332 m2 (3573.6 ft2)
Empty weight: 7,921 kg (17,426 lb)
Crew: 7 (commander, pilot, copilot, radio operator, and fuel attendant in thecockpit,
two mechanics in the engine nacelles)
Empty weight: 7,921 kg (17,426 lb)
Loaded weight: 11,848 kg (26,066 lb)
Maximum speed: 135 km/h (84.35 mph)
Range: 800 km (500 mi)
Endurance: 7 to 10 hours
Service ceiling:4,320 m (14,173 ft)
Rate of climb: 101 m/min (350 ft/min)
Armament: 1 x 7.92mm Parabellum machine gun in trainable nose position.
1 x 7.92mm Parabellum machine gun in trainable upper wing pulpit position.
1 x 7.92mm Parabellum machine gun in rear fuselage cockpit on flexible mount.
1 x 7.92mm Parabellum machine gun in rear ventral position.
Bomb load: Up to 2,000 Kg(4,409 lbs) of bombs


The first delivery of the Staaken R.VI’s was made in June 1917 and the first deployments were to the Eastern Front (Kurland, Russia).

In September 1917, some R.VI’s were transferred to the Western Front (Ghent, Belgium) where they began operations against French and British targets. Later, more R.VI’s were transferred to France (Castinne) for operations against French targets, primarily sea ports and aerodromes.

The attacks using the R.VI against mainland Britain began in September 1917. Sorties by around five aircraft were flown against the capital at night and between September 1917 and May 1918. A total of 11 such raids took place during which 30 tonnes (29.5 tons) of bombs were dropped without the loss of a single R.VI aircraft over Britain; two aircraft crashed on returning to their home bases.

As was to be the case in the Second World War, London’s river Thames provided an ideal navigation tool, and individual R.VI’s were able make their independent way to their specified targets.

Attached Files


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#17 Brutal_Baron

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 20:15

Ilya Muromets(Sikorsky S-22) had a crew of Ten. It was a monster WW1 bomber used by the Imperial Russian Air Force designed by the legendary Igor Sikorsky. Over 80 were built. During World War I it became the first four-engine bomber and dedicated strategic bombing unit. This heavy bomber was unrivaled in the early stages of the war, as the Central Powers had no aircraft capable enough to challenge it until much later.

Various numbers and combinations of guns at different points during the war, including 12.7 mm, 15.3 mm, 25 mm, 37 mm, and 76.2 mm guns, Maxim guns, Lewis guns, Madsen guns, Colt machine guns and Leonid Kurchevsky's experimental recoilless guns among them. Various loads of 50 kg, 100 kg and 656 kg bombs or 6 x 127 mm rockets (under the wings) depending on fuel, armament and crew carried. With three crew and two defensive machine-guns, a V type Ilya Muromets could carry 500 kg (1,100 lb) of bombs.



http://en.wikipedia....y_Ilya_Muromets" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://en.wikipedia....y_Ilya_Muromets
also here
http://www.aviastar....ja_muromets.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.aviastar....ja_muromets.php

Image

Image

General characteristics

Crew: four to eight (up to twelve)
Length: 17.5 m (57 ft 5 in)
Wingspan:

Top wing: 29.8 m (97 ft 9 in)
Bottom wing: 21 m (68 ft 11 in)
Height: 4 m (13 ft 1 in)
Wing area: 125 m² (1,350 ft²)
Empty weight: 3,150 kg (6,930 lb)
Loaded weight: 4,600 kg (12,000lb)
Powerplant: 4× Sunbeam Crusader V8 engines, 148 hp (110 kW)[2] each
* Fuel and oil: 600 kg (1,320 lb)
Performance

Maximum speed: 110 km/h (68 mph)
Wing loading: 36.8 kg/m² (7.5 lb/ft²)
Power/mass: 7.7 kg/hp (16.9 lb/hp)
Endurance: 5 hours with 300 kg (660 lb) of bombs & armament, 10 hours with extra fuel.
Armament
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#18 Interloper

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 22:20

Hey Vander!

I added to my info to your spread sheet there.

Interloper
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#19 SC/JG_Oesau

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 22:51

Since this can be a huge project, ppl should be able to add new entries directly. How about something like this?

http://spreadsheets....d=0&output=html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://spreadsheets....le.com/pub?key= … utput=html

Please add your aircraft in the spreadsheet directly! :)

I think regular copies will have to be made in case of abuse…

Agree with this approach as there needs to be some wall to have a truly collaborative approach to this information. However we do need to define:

- Information required (what information were you after Jason?)
- Reviewing of the data and in some way ensuring that rubbish data or "suspect data" is not added. Without passwording it there isn't a way around this unless you add version control of some kind.
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#20 Millst0ne

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 22:52

For some reason i cannot quick post here :?
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#21 SYN_Vander

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 23:24

Agree with this approach as there needs to be some wall to have a truly collaborative approach to this information. However we do need to define:

- Information required (what information were you after Jason?)
- Reviewing of the data and in some way ensuring that rubbish data or "suspect data" is not added. Without passwording it there isn't a way around this unless you add version control of some kind.

Yes, we need a moderator. Anyone up for the challenge?
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#22 Interloper

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 23:37

I may be interested…

What would be required of me? Would I have to check and confirm all entries, keep everything clean. etc.

Just want to know what is required, before I jump in.
I have all kinds of other stuff I am supposed to be doing. :)
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#23 Jason_Williams

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 23:45

Since this can be a huge project, ppl should be able to add new entries directly. How about something like this?

http://spreadsheets....d=0&output=html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://spreadsheets....le.com/pub?key= … utput=html

Please add your aircraft in the spreadsheet directly! :)

I think regular copies will have to be made in case of abuse…

Agree with this approach as there needs to be some wall to have a truly collaborative approach to this information. However we do need to define:

- Information required (what information were you after Jason?)
- Reviewing of the data and in some way ensuring that rubbish data or "suspect data" is not added. Without passwording it there isn't a way around this unless you add version control of some kind.

The information I am after is essentially what has already been posted on the Google sheet. i.e. the different plane models and variants, their numbers built and physical and perfromance specs. But don't make it too complicated guys.

I like to have a document like an Excel spreadsheet that I can manipulate and others can use for their own purposes, but the Google approach works fine for now to be able to add and substract from by others.

Basically someone shuld create all the fields on Google and the rest make a post in this forum with the data they posted and just list their source(s) with maybe one smallish pic to show what plane you added.

I also want each major variant to have it's own entry. If info is missing just leave the field blank and then we'll fill in as we discover new info.

Jason
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#24 Laser

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 23:58

This: http://ww1-aircraft.info/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://ww1-aircraft.info/ should be very useful, if i'm not mistaken is made by a gentlemen which played/modded Targetware's simulator (Mossie).
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#25 Interloper

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 00:05

That is quite extensive! :shock:

Now all we need to do is find all the specs for all of them! ;)
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#26 Jason_Williams

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 00:37

This: http://ww1-aircraft.info/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://ww1-aircraft.info/ should be very useful, if i'm not mistaken is made by a gentlemen which played/modded Targetware's simulator (Mossie).

Yes this is a lot of info to start with. He seems to list everything possible that flew during the war years. I don't like his format for displaying it, but it's very useful.

Jason
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#27 catchov

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 02:41

Then in a future project we'll work on placing them in history with what sqaudrons used them and where they could be found at the front. My future goal is to create a snapshot of the airwar on any given day or week of the war.

Jason


Wow :shock: This is great news :) This could be my favourite thread of all time :D
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#28 HotTom

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 06:19

http://patriot.net/~...end/WW1AirMap2/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://patriot.net/~...end/WW1AirMap2/
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#29 Karma-Police

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 17:05

Jason, have you chronological limits or 1914-15 planes are accepted ?
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#30 Jason_Williams

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 17:25

Jason, have you chronological limits or 1914-15 planes are accepted ?

No you can list any important plane and variant from the beginning of hostilities to the end.

Jason
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#31 Jason_Williams

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 17:27

http://patriot.net/~...end/WW1AirMap2/

Yes Tom this is a good reference site for squads. It's presentation can be improved though.

Jason
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#32 SYN_Vander

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 18:25

I changed the access rights to the google spreadsheet so you can only edit through this link:

https://spreadsheets...uthkey=COL1obMH" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">https://spreadsheets...gle.com/ccc?key … y=COL1obMH
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#33 SYN_Vander

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 19:34

I may be interested…

What would be required of me? Would I have to check and confirm all entries, keep everything clean. etc.

Just want to know what is required, before I jump in.
I have all kinds of other stuff I am supposed to be doing. :)

Just check every now and then that no garbage has been entered. If ppl keep using the right syntax/units it will also be very easy to compare performance etc.

Also, a weekly backup would be nice: You can use "Download as" for that (CSV or Excel so you can import again)

Oh, and make ppl fill in the spreadsheet instead of just posting links! :)
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#34 Jason_Williams

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 20:13

I may be interested…

What would be required of me? Would I have to check and confirm all entries, keep everything clean. etc.

Just want to know what is required, before I jump in.
I have all kinds of other stuff I am supposed to be doing. :)

Just check every now and then that no garbage has been entered. If ppl keep using the right syntax/units it will also be very easy to compare performance etc.

Also, a weekly backup would be nice: You can use "Download as" for that (CSV or Excel so you can import again)

Oh, and make ppl fill in the spreadsheet instead of just posting links! :)

Although it seems like a good idea I already see people screwing with it. I tried to clean up the format and some jerk was fighting me. Is there any other way to restrict who can do what?

Jason
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#35 HotTom

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 20:21

http://patriot.net/~...end/WW1AirMap2/

Yes Tom this is a good reference site for squads. It's presentation can be improved though.

Jason


True. The presentation could be better but it obviously represents are very thorough database and a whole lot of work by the author.

I don't even know who originally made it (I've had it bookmarked for several years).

And it doesn't seem to include the French or American squadrons for some odd reason. Perhaps there is an adjoining map to the south (I've looked but never found one).

Nor does it include the front line (which, of course, moved over the course of the war) as what I would consider an essential reference point.

But I think the idea of placing the information in a map format gives some visual spatial reference points (cities, rivers, the coastline, etc.) that give both specific (squadron, aerodrome) information and some idea of their relationship to The Big Picture, especially adjacent and opposing forces.

Make whatever use of it you can find helpful.
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#36 SYN_Vander

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 20:39

I may be interested…

What would be required of me? Would I have to check and confirm all entries, keep everything clean. etc.

Just want to know what is required, before I jump in.
I have all kinds of other stuff I am supposed to be doing. :)

Just check every now and then that no garbage has been entered. If ppl keep using the right syntax/units it will also be very easy to compare performance etc.

Also, a weekly backup would be nice: You can use "Download as" for that (CSV or Excel so you can import again)

Oh, and make ppl fill in the spreadsheet instead of just posting links! :)

Although it seems like a good idea I already see people screwing with it. I tried to clean up the format and some jerk was fighting me. Is there any other way to restrict who can do what?

Jason

Sure, You can add people using their email address, so only the ones in the list can edit. I'll test it with your email address Jason, check your mail!
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#37 No43_Moggy

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 22:51

Would you be open to the idea of putting variants of aircraft currently in game on the list, such as the Sopwith Camel with a Clerget 9bf engine for example?
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#38 Jason_Williams

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Posted 13 January 2011 - 23:27

Would you be open to the idea of putting variants of aircraft currently in game on the list, such as the Sopwith Camel with a Clerget 9bf engine for example?

Yes that's fine.

Jason
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#39 150GCT_Veltro

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  • Posts: 715

Posted 14 January 2011 - 11:30

This is a bump about data you should have. To be sure about it, i post them again.

Albatros D.III (OEF) and Spad VII and others Spad.

Albatros DIII (Oef)
Image

Image
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#40 Millst0ne

Millst0ne
  • Posts: 1425

Posted 14 January 2011 - 11:36

How bout this one? http://www.wwiaviati...german1915.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.wwiaviati...om/experimental … n1915.html

I just had to :D That thing must be high on the list of planes you intend to make, right Jason? :lol:
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